#173 Medicinal Mushrooms – Graham Upson

Take a deep dive into the incredible world and healing power of Medicinal Mushrooms with Graham Upson of Touchwood Mushroom Farm.

With over 45 years of mushroom growing experience, Graham is WA’s leading expert in this field. He shares some of his stories learning how to grow and think like a mushroom as well as the businesses he’s developed along the way. You will soon begin to appreciate just how complex and precise growing mushrooms is.

Graham then talks about the main medicinal mushrooms that he supplies and their properties – lion’s mane, turkey tail, cordyceps, chaga, reishi, maitake and shiitake.

This is a fascinating conversation; Graham is a real font of knowledge in this field.

As the listener, you will soon realise that there’s so much more to learn and explore when it comes to mushrooms.

https://www.touchwoodmushrooms.com/

Read Full Transcript

 

Bryn Edwards 

More and more many of us are waking up to the medicinal nature of mushrooms and the potential they can have on our physical, mental and emotional well being. Which is why it was an absolute privilege this week to speak to Graham Upson, who is one of who is leading, probably the leading mushroom expert here in the state.

 

Graham has over 45 years of experience and it’s an he tells us of how he’s ground that out over years, developing a business that supplied gourmet mushrooms. And now how he’s moved into the medicinal mushroom field.

 

On top of that, Graham goes gives you an idea of just how complex and how precise it is to produce mushrooms on a on a commercial scale. But then also he deep dives into some of the medicinal natures of some of the most well known mushrooms that you may have heard of. Ranging from lion’s mane, Turkey tail, Cordyceps, Chaga and a few others.

 

This is a fascinating, fascinating conversation. And the more you dive into it, the more we begin to realise that there’s so much more to explore. And again, we’re only at the top of knowing more about this fascinating, fascinating food.

 

So I’m sure you’re gonna enjoy this. Graham’s a super, super articulate, lovable guy. So enjoy Graham.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Hello, and welcome back to WA Real. I’m your host, Bryn Edwards. Today I have the great pleasure of talking to Graham Upson, Graham welcome to the show.

 

Graham Upson 

Thank you.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Thank you very much for making time in your busy day to host me here in your factory. Is it a factory or a farm or mushroom farm

 

Graham Upson 

generally called far We call it the facility,

 

Bryn Edwards 

So today we’re gonna talk about medicinal mushrooms, and particularly your business here at touchwood down here in Denmark. And so I understand that previously, you had a gourmet mushroom business closer up to Perth. And then you’ve spent some time in the wine industry between that. But you’ve come back to mushrooms. Is that correct?

 

Graham Upson 

Yes. So I never really lift mushrooms. You never really last but we we basically build a farm in Peru. Well, there’s no one growing mushrooms in Western Australia. When I first started, there was a couple of guys playing. Yeah. And my wife and I were living in trees and at the time. Yep, up in Perth. Just got married. And we were looking for something rather than I was a photographer. I was a commercial photographer.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So there’s no farming or growing background.

 

Graham Upson 

It goes back to my father who was on the land. Yeah, in the UK, because I came over when I was nine years old, from Essex. Yeah. And Suffolk, Norfolk, that was sort of our area. And come over when I was nine years old, and logged into Australia, and mom and dad really didn’t know where they want to live. I went back several times. That sort of syndrome, which is quite common year abroad. And I knew we wanted to be we wanted to be here. Yes. And but they couldn’t make their mind up. So we went back several times. But then my brother and I met our two Australian wives on the ship going back on the last time. And that was it that we threw the anchors out and said we want to go back to Australia with their parents, basically. Yes. And so we end up in Australia and stayed. Yes, sir. So we got married in 74. Yeah. And then I was a photographer. I was a commercial photographer. I used to grow, grow, but take pictures of audit fashion photography for two and a half years, right. I do tabletop photography, industrial photography. I used to do all the, all the magazines, and I work for an advertising agency, Ogilvy and Mather, which is a major worldwide organisation was their only photographer in House photographer of all their offices in the world, right in Perth. Okay, so that was rather special. And and then went back to England for a while of 16 months and spent a bit of time in the North Sea as a underwater photographer on the rigs, right? So basically, it was my job to go down and see if there’s any issues with the rigs, cracks and whatever, along with a lot of other Navy divers, and they would come down and say, you know, we’ve spotted cracks on leg b 29, whatever it is, because there’s motion sensors on the rig. And if this if it’s moving too much in one direction or the other. Yeah, I know there’s a problem. Yeah. So it’s my job to go and photograph the issues. And then depending on the strength of the photographs, whether they were sent down the underwater welders or they would abandon the rig or whatever they would do. Yeah, so that was my job for a while that cold, cold, dangerous, and, and basically no visibility. It was pretty ordinary. But exciting, yes, just an aspect of my photography and I used to do the underwater photography and also the ultrasonic ultrasonics as well on the on the, on the work as well. But so I did that for a short while and then came back to Australia and got married and then looking for something rather different than photography. We were up in the hills in kalamunda.

 

Bryn 

Yes,

 

Graham Upson 

came across this retired wheat farmer who has grown a couple of mushrooms in his back shed. And you know, he wasn’t doing a particularly good job of it because he knew nothing about it. As no one knew anything about it. No one NWA. Even the IT department. I went to the ag Department said I want to grow mushrooms. I said, Well, cows, you know, wheat sheep, pigs, we can give you a hand with machines have no idea. Yeah, go to France. They grow mushrooms in the caves in France that they all said, Oh, yeah, I know they do. But I’m not going to France. So we didn’t buy his property. We ended up buying 10 acres down at Bell ravus casuarina, south of Perth. And we put up a trial ground room. It was you know the old in the old fashioned terms. 20 foot by 20 foot. Just a little grown room? Yeah, we built with secondhand bricks, because we think, you know, we, this is maybe not gonna work. We don’t spend too much money on it. So we put up a child grown room and we had no idea what we were doing. Had no idea about composting, clones spawn soils. pH is I had no idea. Yeah, but this guy up in the hills said, if you can grow these damn things, you’ll make a fortune. He says I can sell everything I can grow. Well, that was probably not too hard, because he made a mushroom over there and went over there and went over there. You know, it wasn’t doing a particularly good job of it, right? But he was hooked. But he was 85 then this little guy. And so we ended up putting up straw grohmann and we, you know, sort of 10 kilos. And then took him to the shop and the shop said when you got you got any more, you know, in three months time, you know, and we put another crop through. And then we ended up sort of had 40 boxes, yeah, of mushrooms and took it to the local wholesaler. just down the road from us sandwiches is gone. Yeah. And he said, Oh, we don’t sell machines now. But I’ll take you into the markets for you in the morning. So here we go. Six o’clock the next morning, he rang. He said you couldn’t do more of those. He said they flew out? I said no, not for not for weeks. Yeah. So I said, Oh, we’ll do these two. Absolutely. He says, you know, if you grow those says, you do well as a second time have heard this

 

Bryn Edwards 

sound, get the feedback.

 

Graham Upson 

I’m starting to get some feedback here. And he said,

 

 

Well,

 

Graham Upson 

as many as you can grow, I reckon we can sell. So had long story short, there, we spent six years playing with mushrooms, right? very successfully losing a lot of money. Because we had no idea what we’re doing, we were buying materials that weren’t suitable. There was grows ovaries to grow mushrooms. But the materials are so different to ours, that they couldn’t help us. So it’s really like you got to learn the hard way. This is the hard way to become a mushroom grower. mycologist You know, I call this really hard by so after six years, we’re growing, you know, not 200 kilos a week. Right? And, and then we decided, well, we’re feeling a bit more confident about this. We put up a couple more grown rooms been

 

Bryn Edwards 

a tough six years.

 

Graham Upson 

It was ordinary, very ordinary, because it was physically hard work to Yeah, because there’s no faultless there’s no lifting equipment. Everything is manual, the tone in the compost was with a pitchfork. Yeah, you know, turn a bit, mix a bit, shovel a bit, water it come back, do it again and you’re doing 10 tonnes of compost at a time having to be turned every other day. You get pretty fit. Yeah. And the end of the day, it was thought there’s got to be a better way of doing this. So you know, we ended up laying some more concrete and getting a lifting machine of some sort rather than the wheelbarrow. And, and let me put up a couple more grown rooms which are about 10 metres by five metres, put up two more of those. And then we know we got up to 300 400 500 kilos a week.

 

Bryn 

Wow.

 

Graham Upson 

And and then we put up another three grown rooms. About year nine, you might say we’re growing a tonne a week. Then we put out three more grown rooms and growing sort of random at two tonnes a week. And then we plateau like Selling. Absolutely. I’ve never had an unsold box of mushrooms in my life, right? Never, ever. So basically, we got to that stage and we played out for a while because then we got serious about environmental control. We’ve got air conditioners and humidity control. Which you need all that if you want to start growing high yielding crops, you know, yeah, you can’t just put your finger in the ears. I think it’s right today, we’ll leave the door open for a bit of inflation. You know, chess doesn’t work that way. Not with mushrooms. So we ended up buying some air conditioners and put those on. This was all costing a lot of money. And, but there were a couple of times a week. And we were getting really good process to the mushrooms the profit, the profit margin was high. Yeah, in the end when we got established, but then we bit the bullet and said, and I was an IMG director for five years Australia mushroom Growers Association. I was on the board for five years. Yeah. And when I used to go to the meetings, they said that the new systems coming out in Holland, the Dutch shelf system, which is fully automated, totally computerised, where the compost gets winched in on nets and back out on nets, push button. Everything gets sterilised in bulk not in trays. And we bit the bullet and put in a turnkey project from Holland, right? millions of dollars worth. And we put that in and very hard to get to know how to use this sophisticated equipment because when you just push putting pushing buttons to control the environment, you really got to know what you’re looking for. Yeah. So our farm was run by the Dutch for a while by the internet. They’re in control of our computers for the first six weeks. They were controlling our environment and working on my feedback of what was happening as well. Because it’s always the growers feel. Just the computers. Nothing replaces. Yeah, the growers footsteps in the green room over nothing. And now I’m pulling on now years of experience of mushroom growing. So here we are with this most high tech mushroom farm in Australia, if not the world. Yep. And we could up to 20 tonnes of mushrooms a week.

 

Bryn 

Good luck.

 

Graham Upson 

76 staff basically picking sometimes halfway through the night picking mushrooms. Sunday mushrooms to Singapore, Tokyo, Borneo boost supply. The the woody got the Shah or the Yes. Oh, of Borneo. Yeah, he would order 40 cases of mushrooms a week and that was flowing directly up to him every Thursday afternoon. Yeah, that was his order. Yeah. So we

 

Bryn Edwards 

these what type of mushrooms are you growing at this point?

 

Graham Upson 

Are we just growing the Agaricus Bosporus, which is the button mushroom? Yeah. And most people would know is the ordinary mushroom you’re seeing coals and was more or less commies, Swiss Browns portobellos and the big field mushrooms. So we had a range of mushrooms at that stage. Yeah, yeah. That was it was exciting. Really exciting part of our life because we were thumping along. Yeah. And we had a virtual monopoly. There’s a couple of farms started up after that, you know, they’re not growing as much as us. We were putting down like something at the 800 square metres of area a week. of growing area. Wow, which is a lot of compost. We were making 150 tonnes of compost a week.

 

Bryn 

Good lord.

 

Graham Upson 

And we had these massive composting machines which were you know, like seven eight metres long, and two metres three metres wide. And, and which we built ourself, because we couldn’t bring these in from America are just too expensive. They were like three to four to $500,000 a machine well, so we had it built locally. And we built our own machine and this is a brute of a machine big drum on the front used to beat us up and throw it out the back and mix it up, water it as it goes. Huge machine like 18 tonnes this machine. Anyway, so we we had 150 tonnes of compost coming off the compost yard every week. Which is where the science is. And if your compost is not right, yep. You won’t grow mushrooms. It doesn’t matter how good your grower is, or how good your growing rooms are, or how tight your environmental control is. If you compost is not right, your substrate it’s not right. no different to what we’re doing now. You won’t grow mushrooms, right? It’s all about the chemistry of the compost.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So what are the key things that go on in the compost?

 

Graham Upson 

You’ve got to get your nitrogens. Right? Your moisture levels, right? Your protein and carbohydrates level, right? But you’ve got to know and understand how all this changes and moves or the numbers move during composting. Right. And they do from wetting down the store to start with, because the basic ingredients of compost is wheat straw. So we take the stubble the farmers take the heads off the wheat, we just want the stubble that’s left because it’s got some structure to it some strain. We want the lignin Yes. coating on the store. That’s the food for the mushroom. Right. So we take the stub or the straw. We’ll take the chicken manure we just about took all of Western Australia’s chicken manure weekly, federal chicken farm sewn up, because we were going through 60 to 80 cubic metres a week. Wow. A lot of chicken dung, let me tell you. Yeah. And then gypsum used to take all the Brewers grains from the swan brewery, all the leftovers from the brewing process, take all that as well. couldn’t get enough of that. And on in the early days, we use these

 

Bryn Edwards 

businesses quite grateful that you were taking their excess stuff.

 

Graham Upson 

Yeah, well, some of them were doing a real service. The straw was for the farmers was either burnt and just lit to go back into the ground as a as a potash type thing. Yeah. Or, or just plug it back in chicken manure, Lady issues with the environmental side of things with the fly build up and issues like that. So we would take it and use it. So we would compost it. And that was the end of that. What was the problem after that? Yes. And then gypsum was straight out the ground and natural product. brewers grains. Well, that was an issue. What do they do with that? Yeah, that was dumping it and creating a creating another fly problem. And it smells Do you know, yeah. So yeah, we were efficient industry. Yeah. But the the other thing is that once we empty the grime rooms, and we you know, we’d have hundreds of cubic metres of compounds coming out of the ground rooms each week. Yeah. And it’s the best thing for the garden. Yeah. So we take products that are an issue, become plastic, we grow a food to feed people. And then we’ve got a pilot goes back into the ground to grow more things. Totally efficient industry. Yeah. And nothing’s changed here. So that’s exciting. That part of it is exciting. Yeah. We always had so many phone calls to make say, Yes, your compost is ready. It was huge demand for the compost. Yeah. So yeah, we’re in the mushroom game up there for 20 years, right. So we basically started in 76. And so 20 years later, we went looking for a buyer. But we got a phone call one day, from the heads of Melbourne mushrooms in Melbourne, who basically is Campbell’s soups, yeah, of America. And they said, You mind if we come over to have a chat? said, Well, if you want me to come over before, yeah, I’d like a Sunday afternoon. Thank you very much. I don’t care what day it is. I came over and said, we’re thinking of getting into mushrooms in Western Australia. And we want to know, if you want to sell your mushroom farm. I said well, depends on a few things. And they were pretty heavy handed about it. And as much as more or less what they said, if you don’t sell to us, we’ll start next door. So in other words, if you don’t sell to us, we put you in a business. Yeah. So I thought we sell there’s an item strapped because there’s no way in the world. They’re going to catch up with the knowledge I’ve got. Yeah, in a rush. Yes. So we said, or you can go back to Melbourne if you want, you know, thank you very much. Thanks for the offer. We’re not interested, reasonably risky thing to do at the end of the day, because you know, you don’t know what their resources are yet, but their attitude was wrong. So I figure, but only a few weeks later, they ring up again. But this was not the American side of the operations with the two Australians that come over, who are managing the mushroom farm side of it. And they’re much more easy to get on with. Let me tell you, yes. And they said that now that we’ve we’ve done our homework, we don’t want to do a Greenfield project. We don’t want to start building a mushroom farm yet getting all the approvals for all the composting because you have to have all sorts of licences to make composites and you’ve got to make sure you’ve got heaps of water. Yeah. Then you’ve got to sort out the marketing the unit, sort out the staff. You’ve got to buy all the gear and then you’ve got to know what to do. Yeah. To add, oh, I’ll do that.

 

Bryn 

I suppose you declare a new

 

Graham Upson 

covenant to declare off. Yeah. So we negotiated for all 11 months. And we were put through the wringer and regards the environmental side of it, because the Americans are really worried about the atmosphere and the environment. So we dug 14 holes around the farm, to quite a depth, check it out if we had any pollution on the site. Because the runoff to some campus is very rich in salts and things like this. And if you upset the water table, or you’re apt you’re in trouble with the EPA For a start, and then that can go anywhere. Yeah. Anyway, we checked it all out. And we had no issues. You know, we done it properly. And the deal went through. So more or less, that was the inner mushrooms for us. And we were had a, we had a clause saying that we couldn’t start at the mushroom farm up for four years, because you know, it could be a major threat. Yeah. So well, that’s fine. I probably could have just sold a mushroom farm. I don’t wanna start another one just yet. Yeah. But within only a year and a half or so. They sold half their operation to another company. So they’re in cahoots with another company, which basically is my, my agreement not to start up again. I was not employed. So meantime, we come down here and put a vineyard in because I was very interested in the winemaking side of things. Again, agriculture fascinated me. So we put in 25 acres of vines here. Really, my focus was Pinot Noir, orange, champagne production, or staffing. I’m supposed to call it. Yeah. And then, but it was only a couple of years after pretty 19 that we decided to put this big complex in here. Yeah, to grow more button mushrooms. Because everybody was on my case down here and saying, Graham, we know you are. Yeah, you know, we used to get your mushrooms from Perth. But you’re down here now. Why can’t you grow them down here for us? And a weekend and I’ll put in a small mushroom farm just doing a couple of times a week with my brother. And because he was looking for something to do too. And so we got into this, and then more or less growing organically, which is not easy to do. Yeah. In fact quite hard to do with mushrooms. Yeah. Because there was a few few chemicals involved with growing buttons and fields and portabellas which I was not at all happy with. And there’s one reason I’d like to get out. There’s a lot of chemicals involved. And, but we were going to be in here with very few chemicals, which is lovely. Yeah, but the yields are lower. diseases are higher. You’re fighting off, you’re really fighting the elements. Anyway, we were growing a few tonne of mushrooms a week and still with the vineyard going. Then I started to make my own wines. I self taught myself as a winemaker and did pretty well did pretty well we got in Copenhagen Arpino was interred in the world Pino taste off. And only 161 pinos are allowed to enter this is like invite only and we got the nod from only two Australian producers of pina colada into an hour an hour Pino winning because we’ve won the show and one Awards Best Pinot in Australia and New Zealand and and roll Perth show the Royal Melbourne show. We’ve done a lot of good things with Pino and I was pretty happy with it. And we came at number one Pinot in the world. So that was a pretty good day too. So we went there and, and then my other love was champagne production. This is me making my own wines here the stage. Yep. And the champagnes basically we’re been sitting in the top five champagnes in Australia for the last six years. And there’s some world class champagnes particularly coming out the cool climate areas of Tasmania and yes, and the corner plum areas and this is a cool climate area down here. It is beautifully suited for champagne production. So our bubbles are narrow seven years on the leaves and absolutely stunning. And we were exporting to Copenhagen and Russia and Poland and London and China. We were doing quite a bit of export with wines to our agent in London. I don’t want to talk about why aren’t you talking about wine you were talking about mushrooms?

 

Bryn 

mushrooms.

 

Graham Upson 

I’ll get I’ll get off it was just one more thing. Yeah, I was were agent in London was very brothers and red.

 

Bryn 

Right,

 

Graham Upson 

which is a very old company for 1698.

 

Bryn 

Yes.

 

Graham Upson 

And they got the role warm for the British royal family. And that was it. In London, so we had some lovely company. Yeah, yeah. Anyway, let’s get back to mushrooms. Yeah, because mushrooms, my first love, you know, the wine came along for the ride.

 

Bryn Edwards 

There’s a real sense that you like to tinker, and learn and master. And

 

Graham Upson 

I’m a process person

 

Bryn Edwards 

process, I like to

 

Graham Upson 

have an idea. And I really like something that not many people have been doing yet, because I want to know it from beginning to end. Right. And that’s me is just get into it and just come out the other side knowing a lot more than most others because you’re learning stuff. Yeah, because I’ve made all the mistakes and are aching, making mistakes. The best way of learning, of course, is using OMG I’m not doing that again, you know?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. That was costly. And that and

 

Graham Upson 

that you can do 10 times a day of mushroom farm that we do, right. So, basically, yeah, we we. My focus is, I’ve always known about medicinal mushrooms. Hmm. I was

 

Bryn Edwards 

gonna ask, how did we Yeah, from? Well, okay,

 

Graham Upson 

well, I mean, basically, I spent my early life with with Pixi mushrooms, as we were called. Filling people’s bellies with mushrooms, you know, just pushing out tonnes of mushrooms. Yeah. And then when we sold that got into this got into wine. The medicinal side kept on coming up. And I’ve read about it for years and, and done a lot of study on it. Yeah, but never been in that position, say this to medicinals until I realised that, you know, there’s more to just filling people’s bellies is about pay, making people live longer, feel better. Help them out. Anybody with particular chronic issues? And the more I read, I realise mushrooms had a part to play. Yeah. organically as well. And but you need to go about it properly.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes.

 

Graham Upson 

Because it’s no good. Just jumping on a mushroom. That’s just not good enough. There’s ways you need. There’s ways you need to process mushrooms to get the compounds out to make you make them worthwhile. Yes. So we put up, we stopped growing the baton machines here, and then put in a class 100 laboratory. Yeah. Which is a fully filtered unit, three microns, you didn’t have

 

Bryn Edwards 

one of those in the previous place.

 

Graham Upson 

No, we got our spawn made by a company in eastern states, who basically is a company that’s worldwide, who makes Poland for just about everybody, Sylvan. And they do a great job. And so but here, because it’s so specialised, you need to be able to make your own spore. So there’s a very technical job. It’s very precise. Yeah. So a class 100 bucks is the least you need to make sure you’ve got the IRS filter properly. Yeah. And before you go in, you dressed up, you know, you got the suit on, you got the hat on, you’ve got the gloves on, you’ve got the mask on, you’re sprayed down with alcohol. And it’s the first job of the day. Yeah, you don’t need to the mushroom farm, he goes straight into the directory. And once you’re in there, you don’t come out. You can’t go back in again, you know, you got to do the whole job. So make sure everything’s in there for you to do. Yeah. So we do our own cloning of mushrooms. We can take mushrooms in the wild and bring them into the lab and then take a sample of it and clone it onto a petri dish, right and grow it out onto a petri dish. And then from that we can grow into grain and make spawn. Yeah, then we can grow the crop again, under controlled conditions. And this mushroom might have come from just the forest just outside. Yeah. So we can grab a turkey tail, or a Reishi, or lion’s mane, or whatever we find or mushrooms that no one’s ever heard of before. Yeah. And bring into the lab and say, well, we don’t know what this mushroom is about. Yeah, but it might be the cure for cancer. Yep. So this is where you get excited.

 

Bryn 

Yeah.

 

Graham Upson 

Because there is over 2 million mushrooms out there. Currently, I’ve heard up to 3.8 million, of which only 2000 really have been identified. Yes. There’s a long way to go. Yes. And that submit to me is excited. And it and reason we are down here, apart from the fact it was a good place for wine is that Denmark has one of the best environments for naturally growing mushrooms and I think anywhere in Australia, right? There’s varieties around here. This is such a natural growing room, you might say this region. Yeah. That this is where I wanted to prompt myself just to say here, I can walk out and grab any sort of mushroom, and lots of different types and bring me into the lab. So I’d like to get in more into that science side of it there. Yes, and start bringing out mushrooms. And maybe no one’s ever seen before. tested before from micronutrients. We’ve supplied mushrooms to Queen Elizabeth to QE two in Perth. I work with the head of cancer biology and they’re also mushrooms are going on from there to the University of Hong Kong. Right for cancer research.

 

Bryn Edwards 

These are the medicinal ones you’re doing. Yeah. medicinals

 

Graham Upson 

we’re doing now. Cancer Research for dementia, Parkinson’s, Alzheimer’s, fatigue, all sorts of things, diabetes, leukaemia, all these sorts of things are being tested for. I’m about to start working with the chemical analysis person to curtain uni. Yep. Because we are getting our mushrooms they are getting so finely tuned that we want to know not only what compounds are in a mushrooms, but what the levels of compounds are in emotions, right. So as we get to know now, how many compounds we need, what compounds we need, and what levels what dosage? Yes. Now there’s a lot of people doing mushrooms, medicinal mushrooms in Australia, are not supplying enough information find out and said about what was actually the mushroom? Yeah. Because if you just grab a fruit buddy of a mushroom, whether it be a lion’s mane Reishi, Turkey towel, whatever it might be. Freeze Dried, and then powder it. You’ve got the powder, that’s gonna do some good, of course, because it’s a mushroom. Yeah, absolutely. But the, the real compounds we’re looking for are locked in the cell wall of the mushroom. And the cell or the mushroom is a catalyst type material. Right? Very hard. And it doesn’t break down unless you apply heat. And in most cases, we do a hot water test. Yeah. And then we would extract some of the compounds with alcohol. So the compounds that are released in the water, other obviously the water soluble compounds, yes. And then the ones in the alcohol or the non water soluble compounds. And we’re looking for all of those. And as there is products on the market that are not doing that.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Right.

 

Graham Upson 

Right. So you got to know what you’re buying. And you need to question the supplier. Is he extracting the compounds that are necessary for good health?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. So are you saying is just literally consuming it is not enough?

 

 

It’s not

 

Graham Upson 

enough. Now you think you think you’re right, because you’re eating a musher? Yes, well, you you halfway there. Yeah. But if you want, you want the real benefits, you’re looking for all the terpenes and the acids that come out during the extraction processes. And if they’re not there, yeah, you’re only getting half the story.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes, your body is not able to extract them.

 

Graham Upson 

The body will not break down. The kindness was of the mushroom going through the digestive system. But if you make them available from the first mouthful, because we kill processes do that. Totally organic processes. You’re going to be better off absolutely better. Yeah. Yeah.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So other ways to consume mushrooms are through how then?

 

Graham Upson 

Well obviously powders is a popular way. convenient way.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So that’s where it has been broken down. And that’s what

 

Graham Upson 

yeah, we will do the processes. So the powders, in our case, have got all those processes done. So those valuable compounds are available in the powders. Yep. All right. And then you got tinctures. Yep. tinctures where, which is another can be heat process, in the case of a tincture, and also an alcohol extraction. And then again, that’s breaking down those cell walls of the mushroom, or the herb, or whatever you’re going to do. Right? You need to know what that particular product needs to be done to it. Yeah, might only be a hot water. Or it might only be an alcohol. Yeah, it might need your extraction, you might need both, right. So you need to know, you need to talk to your herbalist. Yep, or your mushroom person. All right, you mycologist to find out what’s required. And going back again, is what I’m saying is that our products will be supplied with a sheet from Salvatori saying these compounds are available, because we’ve done it properly. Yeah. And without that, I’m not sure whether you’re getting the benefit when I know damn well you’re not getting them. Yeah, yeah. So you are the property you don’t

 

Bryn Edwards 

what is it about mushrooms that? I mean, look. What I’m about to say is so blatantly obvious, but it misses a lot of people, which is that many of the molecular structures that form the basis of our chemical allopathic, drugs and medicines are often a replica of what is naturally occurring in the plant kingdom. Yet and and we seem to forget That yet when we consume like a herb from from from the plant kingdom, it doesn’t just come with one molecular structure, it comes with a whole number of others with it. And but what is it about mushrooms? Because there seems to be a bit of a rise in the focus? Well, certainly for me in the focus of the medicinal nature of mushrooms, what is it about mushrooms that makes them so packed full of this stuff? Does that make sense?

 

Graham Upson 

Yeah, it basically if you’re, if you’re looking at a green plant, or a mushroom? Yeah. Particularly the mushroom is growing. And because of medicinal. They mainly grown decaying wood. So they’re in a forest. Yeah. And we know we’re not growing a tree that’s just fallen, right? Yeah, it’s got to be fallen. It’s got to be felt for years. Yes, that wood is breaking down itself. Then all of a sudden, the spore comes along and then lands on that piece of wood and all sudden you’ve got this bracket fungus growing. Yes. Could be a turkey tail. It could be anything preachy, could be you know, it could be a Heron, ISIS. lion’s mane. So basically, that mushroom down decided that that wood is habitable for that mushroom. And that’s Baldwin Grove. And this is everything’s right.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. So they’re quite particular.

 

Graham Upson 

Oh, yes. Yeah, they will not they won’t land on the sand and grow. Right? Yeah. And so and the spores in the air everywhere, you know, to thousands of feet in the air, and they’re just travelling the world, the spores, they’re just moving around content content. Wow. And, and you’re breathing in spores is particularly now you’re in a mushroom farm. Yeah. But so basically, what they’re doing, they’re very efficient at extracting those micronutrients at that decaying wood,

 

Bryn 

right.

 

Graham Upson 

And all different types of wood, in different types of environments and rainfalls. And, and in fact, you know, countries. So what they’re doing is they’re putting out nutrients in such an efficient way that I don’t think we’ve actually considered that we could do that. Without the mushroom. The mushroom more efficient doing that there anything in science has been able to replicate.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So this right, this is fascinating that you’ve just mentioned this, because for some reason, I have been cogitating at times about our relationship with food, and how, if you break it down, what we’re trying to do is give ourselves the, the nutrients and, and things that we need the body to function. And certainly what certainly, you know, considering the plant kingdom, it seems to be one of sharing and there is, there is all these neutrals, going backwards and forwards between trees, plants, mushrooms, etc, etc, etc. And it just strikes me that that we could do this better as humans. Does that make sense? Is that what you’re saying? In terms of we have a lot to learn from the mushrooms in terms of a lot to learn? Yes,

 

Graham Upson 

absolutely. A lot to learn. Mushrooms are incredibly efficient at what they do. And we were going to start with basically I think, with the crops that we eat these days, we’re eating rapidly grown plants and push to production levels. Yes, because the dollar is important to survive.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. As you witnessed previous that,

 

Graham Upson 

yeah. So mushrooms. In our case, we grow them naturally, at their own pace. And mushrooms have got their own time frame anyway. They’ll just they’ll just grow at their own pace. And

 

Bryn Edwards 

there’s no spraying them to bring them on quicker or

 

Graham Upson 

nothing. This is totally organic here. All our materials are just derived from the robe materials from forest. Our wood base that we use here isn’t the old growth Gera forests. There’s no sprays out there. Yeah. And there’s no chemicals at all in any one of our processes here to grow mushrooms, right. So pesticide free. So basically, the hygiene we keep in the rooms is not that high, because we don’t want to go in there and spray things so flyers and banners. So there’s one of the reasons that I grow one flush on all our crops. Because if you keep crops in for more than one flesh, disease builds up other B moulds, you know, competitive modes like trucker derma, or the fly levels would come up. And so we were quite, we’re quite happy to work with one flesh and get the crop off. Yeah. And then ditch that and then come in with a brand new crop and keep the hygiene there was right up there. And a lot of people in commercial mushroom growing, you know we’re going through flushes but in in back machines, you got totally filtered air. And a few chemicals involved even in the material, not just in the air, or the floors, but it was in the air as well. Yeah, but also in the material and the case until there’s things put in there to stop fly production. Yep. Okay, so not everybody knows about that. But it’s just standard practice. Yes. Because you would not get away with it. And also the shelf life but mushrooms. Yeah. would be, you know, various shops would wouldn’t be happy with getting two days out of mushroom when they want for Yeah. One of the good reasons I’ve got out of it, yeah, yeah. But here, here, we’re working naturally. And working with the clones of mushrooms that we’ve selected. Which is, you know, we can do that with our lab here. And there’s various mushrooms, we can’t grow in Australia. Two reasons, climatic conditions. And the other one is the fact that we’re not at bring them in. Yep. That’s the SD spawn or the or a culture? Yeah, one is chogha. Yeah. chogha grows off the birch tree in the very cool climates of you know, Siberia, Mongolia, the Yukon in the Northern Hemisphere. Yeah. So it’s basically a growth that’s on the side of a tree like a burl. A very dark powder. And we get that from Northern Mongolia. Yep, we’re on ganic source, of course. But it’s basically you’re getting up there anyway. Because growing in the forest, yep. And we get that and that’s all treated. Yep. There’s extracted, so we get the right compounds. And the other one is quarter steps. Yes. Quarter steps is is your mushroom. That is one of the weirdest mushrooms out was I mean, I don’t know if you know how a quarter step grows in the wild. But basically, again, the spores are floating around. And the quadriceps come from, like 4000 metres up in cool climate areas, mountainous regions of Tibet and places like that. And then in China and places that are very cold. And the spore or quarter set is it will land on a dead insect grow on the medium of the internal parts of the insect and then grow at the eyes or the brain of an insect and come up as a mushroom. So it’s it basically is set prophetically grows on this little mushroom, and the long skinny little orange thing and jam packed with goodness. So

 

Bryn Edwards 

if you want to grow that you’d have to have a load of dead insects.

 

Graham Upson 

No, we’ve got a bit smarter than that. Yeah, part of the fact we can’t bring that clone into Australia at the moment. That’s just, it’s just biosecurity. We’re not allowed to do it. Which is a bit nonsense. Really. Yep. But we won’t go there.

 

 

Yep. And

 

Graham Upson 

so if you’re trying to get mushrooms in the wild quadriceps in the wild, you’re going to be paying something in the region $60,000 a kilo? For them, because you know, they’re just one there. One over there might be another one over there and anchor Oh, so over that way. hand picked? Yeah. $60,000 a kilo,

 

Bryn Edwards 

right.

 

Graham Upson 

One of the most expensive growing things ever sold on the planet? Much, much more expensive than truffles? Of course. Yes. So obviously, we can’t do that. We can’t go and gather up or kill loads of insects to grow cordset mushrooms? Yeah. So in the States, they’re developed. And in China, they’re developed a method of growing them on rice, right? A carbohydrate source other sources and we put other things in, and you can grow them in an intensive situation in jars, and they grow up in jars on this by subject. And we’d love to do it. And we’re waiting to do it. And I can do it. I’ve got the lab, I can do anything. Yeah. But we’re not allowed to at the moment. So we bring that in also from a organic trusted supplier that we know. And you know, I’ve been in the mushroom game for 45 years. I know who to deal with. Yes. So basically, we got we got an organic source of rice grown quite a quarter steps. Yeah. But there’s an instance which is the variety you want, which jam packs all the qualities of the energy giving. I was

 

Bryn Edwards 

going to say chango in concept because one of the things I wanted to ask you about is you know, we’ve talked about you mentioned Lion’s Mane Reishi turkey tail chango quadriceps what what did what do they do for want of a better word for we human? What are

 

 

they good for?

 

Bryn 

Yes.

 

Graham Upson 

They will push their own wheelbarrow in and the stars in their own way.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes.

 

Graham Upson 

Quarter sets is very much your energy giving mushroom. Yeah. And very much focused on your giving us a bit more vitality and a bit more spring in your step. Yeah. And without giving you the chemistry of it all. I’ll just yeah, otherwise we could be here for

 

 

Yeah,

 

Graham Upson 

so basically, I’ve got one of the hockeyroos on our quarter zips. Yeah. Yeah. And I did a podcast with her. Yeah. And she, she takes it and she’s got friends of hers are top athletes on quadriceps.

 

 

Yep. And

 

Graham Upson 

good also for your immune system. Very good at boosting your immune system as most of my shows. Yes. And Chaka

 

Bryn 

Yep.

 

Graham Upson 

Highly antioxidant measure. Good. Just feel overall body. You know, just just antioxidants. One of those key words you feel in green plants. Yep. And other things you see advertised like goji berries and you know this, you know, antioxidants. One of those words, right. chog is jam packed with that. Good cardiovascular health and things like this. What else we got? We got straight. Shaggy. Is the range here? Yep. Take it out. Let’s go take it out.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. Supposed to be very good. Rick cancer, isn’t it?

 

Graham Upson 

cancer. One of the unfortunate things about what I do is that I come across a lot of very sick people.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes, who are

 

Graham Upson 

desperate to put in one way is to to find something to counteract, or at least get them off chemotherapy and radiation. for cancer. Some people just get not for six with those treatments. And take it out has has got proven records. You can read any amount of scientific papers, which I do do. predominately boring for most people, but for me very interesting. Yeah. Cancer. Again, immune system boosting? Yeah. Turkey tail is one I recommend for people who come to me with all sorts of issues. But I tend to modulate the level of dosage depending on where they are. Because there’s been very successful. We people remove tree from very sticky situations like stage four cancers. Yeah, he’s on his. So we might even up the dose by like six times. Yeah. Depending on people’s situation. But take it as the one I go for. Yeah, with that. chogha we’ve discussed. We’ve got a six plane mix up there, too, which is all our mushrooms in one jar. Yeah. So if you just want to add this lovely mushroom boost on a daily basis. Yeah, we go the six mushroom blend, which is very popular. Yeah. Because some people can’t really figure out which one they want. Because they all do different things. Yeah. So you take the six clean every day. Yes. I’m getting a bit of help everywhere. Yes. And personally, I take six blend. Yep. Every day. And Lion’s Mane?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes.

 

 

Every day. Now.

 

Bryn Edwards 

First is I’ve been taking lion’s mane and attention format for about four or five months. And we discussed briefly when I first met this morning. If If I was to say that it’s increased my IQ by 10 or 20, most people think oh, yeah, but the speed at which my brain works out is phenomenal. My eyesight super clear. And just the ability to concentrate. I mean, I have a reasonable concentration span. And, but I can just maintain it throughout the entire day. My fiance’s reported the same thing. As I told you earlier on my mother and father are reporting the same thing because I’ve got the same In fact, my mother’s Yeah, suffering with the irritability of being able to think quicker than her friends at the moment more than anything else. Tell us a bit more about lines made

 

Graham Upson 

up fascinating musher. Hmm, I’ve got some in the green room. I can show you growing. I put them in the green room to slow them up because they would have been picked before you got here. Yeah. So I put these children down to two degrees otherwise you wouldn’t see them? Yeah, they’ve been gone. Lion’s Mane I don’t even know what they look like.

 

Bryn Edwards 

They have like this. Well, they have like almost like a main. Yeah. From time. Yeah.

 

Graham Upson 

They’re, they’re like a big shaggy ball of wall you might say. Yeah. And they can grow to around about you know, twice the size three times the size of a cricket ball. And, and you can eat them as a raw mushroom and cook them up in a bit of butter and they just taste like abalone or fish. Yeah, well, crayfish shifts love them. Yeah, but I won’t grow them for fish market because it’s just too perishable. Yes. They’ll get fired. Cause every week so can you supply me with lines by not? I could do but I’m not going to. Yeah, because it’s just too hard to market. Yes. All yours goes to powder, you know, Lion’s Mane hericium erinaceus or her resume Colorado? These are the two varieties that we have available to us. Very closely related. Both have got the beneficial compounds in them. You’ve correctly processed like I mentioned before,

 

Bryn Edwards 

yes.

 

Graham Upson 

Just to eat one, you get some benefits. But as I say, it needs to be extracted to get the benefits. Fascinating mushroom. Not necessarily hard to grow. Yeah. But how to get ready to grow. Right. So you need to do your lab work pretty precisely. You get it right. But they grow and fruit quite quickly. Amazingly quickly. If you get everything right, for anything in the mushroom world, you get it wrong, and nothing happens. Yeah, nothing happens. So you get an immediate result there.

 

 

Yeah.

 

Graham Upson 

But what you’re saying is a common story. I hear I have I have people say I’m on your lion’s mane. I’ve only been on it five days.

 

Bryn 

Yes.

 

Graham Upson 

And I feel alert. clearer. I’ve lost that fogginess. Yep, I’m now recalling names. Yep. Because it coach on neuro transmitters with the money or sheath. Yes, and protects your brain cells and has been linked to repairing dead brain cells. Yes, it’s on everybody’s lips now. You know, crises uneaten lion’s mane, and dementia, Parkinson’s, Alzheimer’s, you know, hideous diseases to get when you’re older. And why not make this part of your daily routine? will drop or a powder on your cereal on a bit of yoghurt? Or your tinctures dropped in your coffee? Yep. Whatever you want to do with it on a daily basis, just to make sure that when you get to 80 or 90, you can still play Scrabble.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. Hold your own.

 

Graham Upson 

And how dry? I think it’s it’s just it’s a it’s a it’s a small cost. Yes. To get into old age and still have your marbles he might say. Yeah. And so I we take that the whole family takes it.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. Right. mandated.

 

Graham Upson 

Just, you know, and it’s processed properly. Yes. Okay. And my Taki Yep. Again, another one that has been listed to help with the issues of chemotherapy. You know, the the outcomes of chemotherapy and bad news, you know, but immune system boosting again, cardiovascular health, and also you like your joint pain and things like this. rheumatoid arthritis thingies, linked, all that sort of stuff. Yep. Reishi Reishi is a lovely mushroom for, again, another bracket fungus, very hard mushroom. It needs to be broken up and powder, because you It’s bitter as hell. Yeah. And generally, the more bitter these mushrooms are, the better they are.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. Because the medicinal perspective.

 

Graham Upson 

Yeah, yeah, certainly not from the palette perspective. Yeah. Because that’s the triterpenes been released during the alcohol extraction. And without that, you won’t get them you won’t get the benefit. They’ll go straight through and out again. Yeah, again, you got to be careful what you’re buying where you’re buying it from, to make sure you’re getting the process correctly. Yes. But ratio is a good one to have five or six o’clock in the evening. Good for sleeping, relaxing, calming. people with ADHD, things like that. Yep. Again, Lion’s Mane is really good at that as well.

 

Bryn 

Yes.

 

Graham Upson 

I’ve had, I had one guy the other day come up to me. He says, I’ve got ADHD. I’ve had it since I was five. And I’ve been on Ritalin all my life. Well, that’s fair enough. Everybody sort of gets diagnosed with that is given that, yeah, this is not many alternatives. As far as I can see that my area. But they say this particular Jeff said I had your lines might have been on it a month. I recognised him from the markets or sold it in the markets to him. And he said, I’ve been on this reading on this Lion’s Mane for a month. I’ve dropped my Ritalin without any side effects. Wow. I said, How do you feel? He says off looks so good. I feel so alert. I feel calmer, like the Rishi does. And I feel like I’ve just turned around. What’s more, he says my son’s has been diagnosed with ADHD. Yeah, and he’s not going on Ritalin. Okay, he’s going straight into lion’s mane. I’ll get ready. bought back in a month or two? series going? To me. That’s what makes this what makes me get up in the morning. Yeah, is that we’ve got mushrooms now rather than say early on filling people’s bellies with mushrooms. Yeah, I’m now producing mushrooms. Because of 45 years in the business on I think like a mushroom, believe it or not.

 

Bryn 

Yep.

 

Graham Upson 

And I just feel I feel better about the whole thing. Yes. In my new lease of life in the my psychological world for me. Yeah. And I can produce mushrooms that can just make people feel better, and maybe even maybe, maybe even cure them. Yes, from things. But we don’t guarantee.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Are there any other mushrooms that you don’t supply at the moment that you’d like to get? Get into? Um,

 

Graham Upson 

there is other varieties. And but I think I’ve got the main range here. Yes, but it’s on everybody’s lips is this range here. I think my next focus is to go bushwood. And find what I’m looking for mushrooms

 

Bryn Edwards 

that are not on everyone’s lips that no one’s got. Yeah.

 

Graham Upson 

And then work with some very, very clever people. And just get them totally analysed with it into their life to see whether we can we can combat other issues that humans can get. That’s where I’m coming from. So now

 

Bryn Edwards 

it’s it’s more time with boots on going out walking looking?

 

Graham Upson 

Yeah, yeah, get him to a stage where I can actually isolate the clone cried out in a petri dish, because not everything grows from a petri dish. You’re only growing naturally in the bush. Yeah. Because that’s where it’s happy. You bring into a lab and a mushroom you think, oh, crap, he’s not real fast about this. Yeah, I’m not going to grow for you. Right, sorry. But the ones that do grow, I get a petri dish. And in from that petri dish, I can literally make, you know, kilos of spawn. And from a piece of mushroom just taken from the centre of the, of the mushroom, just the flesh from underneath the cap or the stalk. I can start with a piece of mushroom that’s the size of a grain of rice. And Grow millions of kilos of mushrooms from that. Because I can make one kilos spore, which will make 10 kilos who make 100 kilos who make 1000 kilos. And from that I can make thousands and thousands of kilos of mushrooms. Wow. And that’s how it exponentially just grows. We need to find mushrooms that can I believe mushrooms have got in their power, the way they grow and the way they extract from nature. My new chemicals that we’re not going to create Yes, in the lab. And that’s probably my next 10 years to do that. For exciting. Yeah. Yeah, it is. It is Yeah.

 

Bryn Edwards 

What do you think? Like you mentioned earlier on, these are the mushrooms that are now on everybody’s lips? Why do you think it’s now that people are becoming more open to all the medicinal natures of mushroom?

 

Graham Upson 

It’s the swing from chemical based products that can bind the shop. We all know that the better it looks in the shop is probably a really good reason not to eat it.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes.

 

Graham Upson 

Because he try and grow veggies you can grow perfect ladies. Because generally in your own veggie patch, you don’t walk around with spray cans, right? Yeah. So there’s holes in it and this and that and that. Okay, well, that’s what happens in nature. Yes, you go. There’s these polished apples and these broccoli that are absolutely the colour that come out of the mould. Yeah, I get immediate suspicious about the whole thing. And people just thinking they’re leaking that to what’s good for you. Man, people have got so much time and so much access to the internet. So much access to what is the Encyclopaedia Britannica called an iPad? Yes, yes. Right. It’s all in there. You can use dial up everything and up It comes with mushrooms and they start reading. That’s the interest. Yeah, because I realised that there mushrooms now can be produced like we do with the facilities naturally. And then we’ve got the testing facilities, we analyse what’s in them that’s good and know how to extract those compounds organically for good health. A lot of interest in so many people are worried about you know, I mean people people want us to produce coffee based mushroom powders. Which you know, we’re going to do because I don’t anybody’s gonna give up coffee no matter what happens. Yeah, so people like their coffee, not only happy coffee, but also to be good for them. So why not have a shot of Lion’s Mane in it? A shot of Reishi shop of Turkey Or even a short of our six mushroom blend daily in their coffee, and they’re gonna feel good about it. Yep. And if we get our doses, right for all that sort of thing, you will feel good about it. Yep. This is all in it. And you just take it along with your favourite drink of the day. Yeah, that’s another thing. We’re working on my daughter’s that coffee. Both my daughters into their coffees. Yeah. So basically, I’ve left that room to experiment with. Yep, I’ll stay with this design side of it. I’ll give you the product. You work out the drinks?

 

Bryn 

Yes.

 

Graham Upson 

I think that’s the thing is everyone knows, so, so switched on to what’s good for them. And mushrooms have just risen out of the heap to the top. And so, so little is known about them. And as I said, When I started, you know, 45 years ago, there was nothing known about them.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. Goes France.

 

Graham Upson 

Go to France? Well, no. And so I’ve come right up through the ranks. And I’ve been thinking like a mushroom for 45 years, which is really unfortunately, I think, well, people are shoot. How do you think I can measure? Well, I can walk into a room. And I can sense there’s something wrong. I know there’s something wrong. Yes. It’s knows it’s feel it’s look, you get that extra sense about what’s going because you’re thinking about what the machine requires. And it doesn’t feel right. And you can because you’ve been doing it such a long time. You can zero in on that issue. And I guess that’s me thinking like a musher. Right. Yeah. And that you walk in the forest and you find a mushroom growing. Think Crikey, that one is growing in this environment on that top of wood. That particular tree type? Yes, this top of year. I don’t know, you start thinking like a mushroom. You just do. And there’s no other way. And you can’t

 

Bryn 

look at all the variables.

 

Graham Upson 

Yeah. And you can’t you can’t teach that to anybody in a rush. You just need to be doing it for years. Look, anybody who specialises they make everything look simple. And I mean, somebody who’s very good at what they do.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. A golfer? Indeed.

 

Graham Upson 

Whatever it might be, you know, Grant me How do you hit that shot every day? He’s done it a few times. I’ve been doing it a while.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. A bit. Isn’t my first rodeo. What have you learned about yourself through all this?

 

Graham Upson 

I’m, I’m a Virgo. Right? I might say something. I’m a Virgo. I like everything to be right. Yes. It’s got to be in place. It’s got to be accounted for. It’s got to be tidy. Yeah. And there’s got to be a result. Yep. And, and, and I don’t think I don’t like the in it’s unexplained to me. So quest for finding the result. Or just being super fancy, super fancy. You can’t, you got to have patience. Yeah, a lot of patience to be a mushroom grower. Because if you didn’t have patience, you wouldn’t last a month on a mushroom farm. And I’ve got patients and I just work through it. And someone else is, you know, throwing the spanner at the workshop walk. I say I can’t do this. I’m picking the spanner up. And I’m going to go and try and fix it. That’s me. Yeah, I need to know how to get to the end result. Yeah. So I think on just one of those types of those types

 

Bryn Edwards 

that she puts into?

 

 

Well, I’m yeah.

 

Bryn Edwards 

And the last question I ask all my guests. That’ll be interesting is it’s a hypothetical question. And it’s basically, if you could upload one question into what was like the collective consciousness, so everybody just sat still for five or 10 minutes? And thought thought about that question. What would it be?

 

Graham Upson  

That’s a curly one to the internet. Well, that question be yes. A question to ask other people.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah, that everyone would consider. Oh,

 

Graham Upson 

okay. Well, this is another podcast, isn’t it? I think we’re gonna have more time for each other. Right. I think we are just scrambling over each other, to get through life in the best way we can. And it’s ugly. It’s ugly in politics. It’s ugly in power. It’s ugly. Money. And we basically were running our patients with each other, I believe. And we need to be able to slow up the world of it to where we fought time for each other. And so I guess that’s where I come in with the mushrooms. I like the idea that I can help people. Yeah. And try Reishi. That’ll help.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah, I’ll tell ya.

 

Graham Upson 

I think that’s the problem. I find these people is just so grumpy and short tempered. And there’s In fact, there’s too many of us. That’s another issue. You can’t see that being addressed soon. But I just feel that we were generally a bit aggro. Yeah. It seems like years gone by we had a bit more time. It was a bit more relaxed. Yeah. But the pressures these days. don’t compete with me at all. I think we should, I think because I’ve led more or less a rural life. We’re doing this. But then again, I’ve run big business. But that was always at my own pace. But it was always a learning curve. So I slowed up, I had to slow up to learn what I was doing.

 

Bryn Edwards 

what you’ve learned to me

 

Graham Upson 

would not, you would not know. Yeah. And I think that’s what we’re all missing out on that the fact that we’re all just moving a bit too fast.

 

Bryn Edwards 

is a deep, deep sense of wisdom in that. Then the rich is married in the mushrooms.

 

Graham Upson 

Maybe you’re right. I will I this I’ll be doing this until I just don’t want to do it. And I can’t see that anywhere. So

 

Bryn Edwards 

I’ve got or until the mushrooms start growing on you.

 

Graham Upson 

I’ve got the next generation coming up that takes my place. Yep. With this business. So you know, my total two daughters were born on a mushroom farm. That’s all they know. Yeah. They bought on a mushroom. I think like a mushroom there. They think like mushrooms here and and they eat their fair share of mushrooms. And they’re on these powders to me know what we’re about. So they’re all tuned in to what we’re doing. And so we’re not going to run out. Yep. And and even though Virgos I’m trying to be super fussy.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Graham, it’s been an absolute pleasure talking to you today. absolutely fascinating. If people want to find you, where do they find the products?

 

Graham Upson 

I’m basically online and most of our works online. So you know, touch with mushrooms are becomes on the internet. Yep. And you can buy online and we ship all around Australia. In fact, the world if you want. Yeah, we’ve sent them to Dubai and wherever online. And and I’m always there to have a chat. People got issues with health. I’m always available to just talk over their issues. Yep. So that’s a service we provide as well. But Yep. As I say, here we are growing mushrooms. And who would have thought that 45 years from seeing a guy growing mushrooms in his back shed? Yes will result in growing, having the biggest mushroom farm in in Western Australia and the most high tech farm probably in the world. And then concentrating on the distance to good health. That’s been my journey.

 

Bryn Edwards 

bonkers.

 

Graham Upson 

And that is where I ended up. Yes. Yeah, I can think that farmer. Well, maybe I can’t thank him. I don’t know. Yeah, I can thank that farmer for having those few mushrooms going in his back shade.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. Thanks very much.

 

Graham Upson 

Thanks, Bryn. It’s been a pleasure.

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