#189 The Pattern of Life; Realm Theory – Roslyn Snyder

This week’s conversation with Roslyn Snyder is all about patterns – the patterns that underpin the human experience and patterns of nature.

Roslyn takes time to talk through Realm Theory that sets the framework of understanding for patterns she’s noticed across her life, vast studies and 20+ years as a practising Clinical Psychologist.

Throughout the conversation, she gives plenty of examples to provide the context for deeper understanding of how it all comes together.

It’s rare to find someone who works at this meta level of connection and who can see such deep patterns; patterns that have been understood and shared for hundreds and thousands of years previously in indigenous cultures. Indeed, Roslyn talks about how she’s not only captured the pattern mathematically but has also sang and danced the patterns.

This is a very deep conversation but right now I personally believe that this is a level of thinking and sensemaking that is missing from the overall conversation that directs where we’re going in the human experience.

Read Full Transcript

Bryn Edwards 

This week, it’s all about patterns, patterns, human patterns, patterns in nature, emerging patterns. And this came about an amazing conversation with Roslyn Snyder. In this conversation, we go deep, deep, into her realm theory.

 

This is a big, big conversation. And if you’re into and see patterns and into system thinking, then you’re going to really, really enjoy this.

 

Roslyn breaks down Realm theory into the three relams. And really explains those. And there was a great opportunity for me to ask lots of questions, which hopefully helps you to understand it in a greater depth. And we talk about its application, we’re talking about the paintings, it’s not just about how this is a mathematical pattern, but she’s also painted it and sang it and danced it.

 

I’m a bit lost for words with this conversation, because there’s so much to it, and it’s really, really powerful. And I’ve listened to it back again since and there’s so much to bed in. So if you find yourself having to stop and pause and reflect for a while. Don’t worry about that. There’s a lot in here. If you if you really do resonate with this, I’d really love to hear from you, please reach out because I think right now the world needs a lot more people who can see systems, see patterns, and really explore those. So we can start to see a future trajectory.

 

Anyway. Roslyn is super fun to talk to, she has a great sense of humour as well as an amazing depth of knowledge. So enjoy, Roslyn.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Hello, and welcome back to WA Real. I’m your host, Bryn Edwards. Today I have the great pleasure of speaking with Roslyn Snyder. Roslyn, welcome to the show.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Thank you. Thank you for asking me.

 

Bryn Edwards 

You’re very welcome. So it was only yesterday, we were on the phone talking. And the topic of patterns came up. Yes. And I said that rather interested you because I was talking about the changes that I’d noticed that people go through between the rough sort of ages sort of 37 to 42. Yeah, and, and that, through the variety of people that I’ve spoken to, in the podcast, have listened to this stories and started to see patterns. And that’s one of those particular patterns that I’ve experienced, and was actually a catalyst for me to start this as I tried to understand the world through other people’s stories, rather than book learning, which I was very good at before creating, reading all this stuff, and then putting maps on the world and then realising that the maps don’t fit. And then in the middle of that, we started talking about patterns. And that’s where it kind of got exciting. And that’s where we agreed to have this conversation.

 

 

Yes.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So at a top level, right, summary intro level, tell me about your pattern?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

The pattern that I see, yes. Okay. So I have actually seen this pattern since I was about five or six years old. Right. And I just assumed everyone saw it. Yes. And so that’s interesting. Yeah. Because I just assumed everyone saw it. Yes. And so when I first started a stall, and the patent helped me understand math really well. And I started doing maths, two to three years ahead of everyone else in the class. And it was really confusing to me that, why can’t other people see this. And then, and it was also the pattern is in human relationships, and it’s, it’s everywhere. And, you know, sometimes the teacher would respond in certain ways. And I’m like, that’s really weird. They’re not saying what I’m saying. And they weren’t seeing beyond what was happening here. And so that has actually guided my entire life, because I wanted to understand what I saw.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. And you had to make sense of totally made sense.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. Because this was like, as fundamental as this table in front of us now. I could see this. And so all through my stalling that’s what I was trying to find out if any other one. Well, at first, I just assumed everyone knew it. Yes. And then afterwards, I was like, hmm, a lot of people don’t see this. So I started to explore that. But along the way, because I’ve had a quite an interesting upbringing. I’ve actually lived with probably close to 100 people growing up,

 

 

right.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So when you live with people in a household is very different. For Just amazing people. And so this pattern was playing out everywhere. And so I ended up, I left straw, and then went back and studied pure science because I was basically told that science has all the answers, right? So I went and studied physics, chemistry, mathematics. And it was like, Yeah, they’re all interested in patterns, but they’re very small patterns.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Right? Right. So you’re saying earlier on with the teachers? Why don’t you go,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Why don’t you say that connected into that, that that that that that

 

 

disconnect?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, the total interconnectivity. And, you know, like in physics and chemistry, it’s all these theorems, you know, the force of the glass here, but it’s very, very isolated. And little. So I worked out that science wasn’t going to help me understand that. And so I decided to study psychology, right? Because I grew up in an environment where there was a lot of, I suppose, violence, alcohol, drugs, and a whole heap of behaviours that weren’t, I don’t know, healthy, not healthy at all. And then I ended up working in a medical laboratory. And in this laboratory, we had lots and lots of medical specialists in the centre. And I started to recognise that there was a pattern in their dynamics, how they interacted with people, which just intrigued me. But and it was the same pattern that I grew up with. But what they were doing was different. Right. So. So, for instance, in my childhood, people would drink way too much. These ones would buy lots of stuff,

 

Bryn Edwards 

right? But

 

Roslyn Snyder 

yeah, and it was still trying to feel something it felt like. And so that’s when I decided I’d go and study psychology, right? Along the way, I had got married and had a couple of children. And so when I started studying psychology, it was, it was amazing. I was learning all this stuff. And I was still but I was still just like, this isn’t what I’m, I’ve been able to see. It’s little parts of it. But really tiny parts of it. Yes. It’s like a glass in your liquor cabinet. They were teaching me about this last, not that there’s 30 different glasses, and they’re all used for different things. Yes. And so that sort of frustrated me a little bit. But you know, I graduated did really well. And, and then it was six months after I graduated. I had a dream. And this dream was of this very concrete picture, which is known as the map. And what I’ve discovered in this simple picture that I can explain to someone in two to three minutes is lots and lots of psycho psychological theories. Right? So another psychologist, did her doctoral thesis on the theories that are in this simple picture that I drew. And that it’s a very concrete pictures. It’s, and it’s about the emotion, emotional landscape that we have. And what I’ve discovered is that it applies to everyone and has places in it. Like the swamp of feelings, the rocky paths, the anger and drop mudflats, the depths of despair, the avoidance marshes, the desolate desert. And so this psychologist, went along and did her doctoral thesis on it. And she found 32 psychological theories within this little picture

 

Bryn Edwards 

that already existed or

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, yeah. You know, yeah. All the different theories and, and all of that. And meanwhile, I’d started using this in my psychology practice. And I, yeah, I’ve had quite astounding results with people because I don’t diagnose for 20

 

Bryn Edwards 

odd years. Oh, yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. 2020 years. And so in my first session with someone, I would show them this little picture, and I just say, and I explain it and say whereabouts are you? And I go, Ah, I’m stuck. I’m here. I said, Okay. So you’re in anger and guilt mudflats. The map shows you because it’s a map. We have to go through the swamp of feelings get to the forest of hope. That’s our treatment plan. And it doesn’t matter what the diagnosis is. So the patterns that are I was saying growing up. So for instance, that theme where I said the emptiness and people trying to feel that emptiness is in avoidance marshes, avoidance Marsh avoidance, so you avoid the emotions. So when we avoid emotions, we wish to actually shut down the feelings. Yes. And we’d go into our headspace. Yeah. And we love book learning with learning. Yeah. And we want to analyse everything. Yeah. And you would have heard of the term analysis? paralysis?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. Right. But that’s a good,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

yeah. So but then people are left with this emptiness, where their heart and emotions need to be. So then they fill it with something. So some people fill it with drugs, some fill it with working 80 hours a week, some fill it with power and press stage. But they’re still feeling empty. That never feels it until we actually get a heart connection with someone. And then there’s other places that will also have addictions or that but it’s for a different reason. Yes. And so it’s an underlying root cause of the behaviour rather than just the behaviour. And so I had this really successful private practice, I had at least a year’s waiting list most of the time, over 50, doctors trying to refer to me, worked with some very, very extreme situations and crises, and that I’ve worked with it in prisons, and all of that. But going back to the pattern, this pattern in this map is a small part of a bigger pattern.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Right?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right, because the pattern in this map gets you. If you go through the map and get to the same old mountains, each time you do it, you get closer to the centre of your life. Right. So when the psychologist interviewed me for the doctoral thesis, one of the questions she asked me was, when you teach about the map, you tell everyone, it’s a mathematical model. What do you mean by that? And how would you do it? And I said, well, the map is actually like a graph. And she was like, a graph. And I said, Yeah, but a four dimensional graph. And as I said, it, I was like, That’s not right. Even though that’s in her faces. I said, Yeah, it’s a four dimensional graph. And I went away. And I started really reflecting on that. And what I realised that it was multi dimensional, not just four dimensional, and that it was part of this bigger pattern. And so then, it was like, wow, what am I going to do with that? And so then I went back to university, just do a PhD. to basically, I suppose, describe this pattern, and then sort of put all the research into it. But once again, it became better than this. And a PhD, is supposed to be a very good this, but deep down, yes, this was deep down, but it was connected to everything this way as well. And above. And, and so I spent three years researching. Reading, have you talked about book learning before? And, you know, when I went to university, because it was so new to me, because I’d left stall early, I didn’t feel that educated, I worked out that I read over 1000 books, well, my three years of undergrad, I would sit in the library, this was before we had the computer systems to search for abstracts and stuff. And I read every abstract in journals from like 1920s to now every abstract in the Journal of personality and individual difference the Journal of love, and then I read the complete works of Freud and Jung. So, so I had this huge learning which is all gone into this pattern, which I have now published as realm theory. Yes. And, and so what I’ve done it’s it’s actually in probably a field called quantum chaos, but it’s could also be called Just complexity theory, some taller nonlinear dynamics. But basically, the universe would be divided into any number of little sections, right? which then becomes too overwhelming, right? But a single frame of reference is too simplistic. Right? So round theory has divided up into three realms, right? And then within each of the realms is three worlds. And the three realms are different frames of reference. And the worlds are different states. Describe it.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Okay. We’ll dive into that. Yeah, I’m just really do dive into that. What strikes me here is and tender, whether this is just what lights my fire as well, at the same time, is that you know, you’re talking about reading 1000 books, or the abstract. What we’re talking about here is always like, operating at a meta level. Yes. And do you think that is probably quite a personal question? Do you think that some people are just wired up to think at a meta level? Or do you think we all have the capacity for it?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

I think some people are wired up to think at that level. And, but a lot more could be trained to throw couraged.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Because when you talked about, and I dive into this to most people, and I want to get into the realm, when you talked about you saw something, but you couldn’t you were confused as to why the rest of the world couldn’t say couldn’t see it. There have been frequent times in my life where I can just extrapolate things. And you can see where they’re going to head. Yeah. But nobody else, you can try and explain that and everyone sort of just glazes or it’s just a bit too much. Yeah, this on the other end. And for many years, I thought, Korea over 11 years of being in a boys boarding school, which was quite a closeted

 

 

exposure was

 

Bryn Edwards 

quite close to the environment. And I was trying to make sense of the world as well, at the same time. I just thought that there was me Yes, right. What why is it that I am drawn to see in the public because I’m a bit slow? Was my conclusion. And that everybody else has already got this. And they already just operated. They didn’t want to spend time talking about this stuff. But at the same time, everyone’s falling into the same bloody traps all the time. Yeah, there was like highly confusing as like, and then you know, the barters in business psych and went and worked in, in as a consultant, and you started seeing the same mistakes repeat is like, what if we made this decision? This is what’s going to happen in 18 months time? Yep. It’s obvious. Yeah. And are living it right now in my part time job. And why just, and for me, personally, it’s only been in the last two years that I finally get to the point ago. Now I just, I’m not putting tickets on was I would see things slightly differently. Yeah, someone could do this. I see it like this.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. So one part of the training I do with people is identifying each person’s own energy pattern, right. And this is like, we’re all born with a particular energy pen. And with round theory, so there’s eight, alternative core energy pens, eight keys, which is what you have to do to open it up. Okay, power, which is your internal power, but what I want us to get to is the focus, and there’s eight levels. And so some people work at the micro level. So they only see micro sort of things outside those micro singular, plural, like group, systemic, universal, and then beyond. So there’s these levels. And so I know that my energy pattern is at the universal level. I’m not at the beyond level. And I’ve met people that are at the beyond level. And and so that’s where my focus is. And people each have their own focus that they’re they’re born with, and when we all are keyed into that, everything. This is my dream. Everything becomes in harmony, because we’re living our nature, place and purpose. So everything we do is not that we can all be all things. No, not at all. The key is to look in find your energy pattern. Right?

 

Bryn Edwards 

So if one of these very micro people, yeah, then potentially a job in engineering and things like that is completely for you.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yes. And I’ve just been working with someone who’s a musician. And everyone wants him to be this universal musician. And he’s just identified that he is at like a family level, or a small group. So now he’s looking at how can he have his little concerts with just 20 to 30 people, right? Because that’s what suits here.

 

 

They want to be like a small Porter.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, he doesn’t want and people have been trying to put him on a big stage. And it’s, and it’s like, that’s not me. Well, it’s not even free. It’s just

 

Bryn Edwards 

not.

 

Roslyn Snyder  

Because he says, I like that intimate connection with people. When you’re performing in front of that many people, it’s just like her. Yeah, you might as well be for him. But someone that’s universal, will have that. height. So there’s these.

 

 

Yeah, that’s fascinating. Yeah.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So should we get into the realms?

 

 

Yes, we can do that. Is that the best way to approach this?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, probably the thing I would like to just so to understand realm theory, we actually, isn’t it a big paradigm shift? Yes. Because most of us want to see things from an independent framework.

 

 

Can you explain what that?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So from our side, so we can see this glass and the water in it? Right. And it’s totally separate from us is totally independent

 

Bryn Edwards 

from us always like the scientific view of it?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And, you know, in psychology, we’ve learned to not be involved. Yes, not get intimately involved with people. But we are sitting here, we’re connected. We can’t say there’s no connection.

 

 

Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And so the, the three paradigm shifts to actually understand realm theory. And the first one is from an independent frame of reference. Yeah. Where we view things from an independent point of view, to an embedded in experience. Yeah. Right. The second one is from a single frame of reference to three alternate frame of reference simultaneously. So from a single frame of reference, yep. Two, three frames of reference simultaneously,

 

Bryn Edwards  

right? So they coexist.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yep. they coexist at the same time. And the third one is consideration of the negative space. Right? So most of us focus on the positive form. So we focus on the glass. This is a glass of water. Yes. Right. But if we put something different in it, it’s a glass of something else. It’s still a glass. Right. But its purpose is different. Because it’s, yeah, from different liquidity. And so the net, so a room in a house, right? Yes. The room is the wall. That’s the positive form. But what we actually use is the negative space.

 

 

Right? So it’s not negative as a bad.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

No, it’s, it’s what we don’t say.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Right? Right. And space is full of that.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And space is full of that. Yes. So and that’s what the three frames of reference are. And that’s what so that’s what round theory is, is having the different frames of reference. But when you look at anything in its complexity, its simultaneously Yes. Does that make sense?

 

Bryn Edwards 

It’s coming together. So we have to have is an independent frame of reference

 

Roslyn Snyder 

from an independent to an embedded experience from

 

Bryn Edwards 

an independent to an embedded embedded meaning from me. Yes.

 

 

Which is, yeah, there

 

Bryn Edwards 

is one frame, but three, all at the same time. Yeah. And then we also have the, almost like, the positive container, but also the negatives can turn Yeah. container, all this data, and they’re together at the same time.

 

 

Yes.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Right.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yep. So for instance, I’ll give you an example from psychology. Cool. So, so a child comes in, because they’re misbehaving at school. Right? So if we just look from one frame of reference, and in psychology, we’re really trying to look at that individual, because psychology is about the individual. But anyone that knows children, their behaviour is a reflection of what’s happening around them. Right? If we don’t consider that, yes, then with, we’re not going to help that child know. And yet, we tend to focus just on that child. And a lot of people will say, you know, the problem child is the squeaky wheel of the family. No, you’ve heard that, yes. But it’s the indicator of is the indicator of something.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So I had this emerging hypothesis, which are floated in the podcast recently, which is that our mental health arising mental health starts. Depression, anxiety, suicide, is an appropriate response to a traumatic and crazy society.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Totally. The the system, but yeah, the system dictates what happens to the individuals within that system. So if you have a toxic work environment,

 

 

yes,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

you will have a lot of people with health problems. Yes. Right. And so round theory can be applied to all of those things to actually and it’s. So when I said, you know, we each have our own nature, place and purpose, a business will have its own nature, place and purpose. Yes. And if they live true to that, yeah, then people within it will be healthy. Yeah. Right. stalls have their own nature, place and purpose. And, you know, the way we actually educate, the way we’ve focused so much in society goes against all the natural laws

 

 

very individually,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

and it creates fragmentation. So it, it creates fragmentation within people. But it also creates fragmentation with inside your brain. Which wait when our brain is fragmented, leads to mental illness. And so I actually learned this from Aboriginal elders, about the connection. So I’d done like eight years of formal studies in psychology class all this time, practising and talking to people on that. And, you know, most of psychology is based on talking therapies. Yes. which assumes verbal, unconscious.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Except the verbal conscious centres of our brain is a very small part of our brain. Yeah. The rest of it is unconscious and nonverbal. Yeah. And yeah, so while we focus on one, we’re actually neglecting everything else. Yeah. And one of the fundamental things with Aboriginal culture is everything has art, song, dance, story, and language. Right, when we do that, so when we learn something, and I spoke to you on the phone yesterday, so when I was trying to get my head around realm theory, I did the paintings. I also actually danced around theory, because that’s embedded in it. So it connects everything in my mind. Right? We can’t just learn it from a book. We can’t just have all this is you’re learning out learning objectives. Here’s your out. Yes. Because that’s not about life. That’s about fragmentations of life.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. Which is part of why I cracked the ships with individually focused coaching. And and many of these things, yeah, so

 

Roslyn Snyder 

yeah. Which is why would you call him? Yeah, well, and which is why a lot of the healing programmes I do now is group based. Because everyone’s learning from everyone else. And it’s all interconnected. Yes. And so we have some, such better outcomes. So I had someone just in the last week that I have been seeing for 15 years in individual practice. And I think I’m fairly good at the individual practice. But we knew that there was this one thing that just wasn’t working. And I said, Look, come to the group, and she’s like, there’s no point in coming to the group. I know everything you’re going to say. She came to the group, and on the second day, it was so obvious what the issue was. Which she had never thought about consciously, never talked about. And it was an in it was a total fear of going out into nature. So she was telling me she needed to go out into nature to feel connected. But she was never actually doing it. Right, because there was this overwhelming fear that she hadn’t even identified. Once we did that, I’ve seen that now and she’s like, everything’s come together. I’ve been seeing her lifting years, what once a month in the Virginia surah. Hello, yeah, but you know, and even, like, I didn’t, I knew there was something not right. But everything I tried in that one hour session didn’t get there. Yeah, but in our group, where we’re just doing art, and song, dance, and all of that, it became so obvious.

 

Bryn Edwards 

And there really is something about having other people. And we can’t identify ourselves and see ourselves in a vacuum. No, we do it by brushing up against others.

 

 

Totally.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Which, yeah, I got about 211 years of being in a boys boarding school. I was doing all day every day.

 

 

Yeah.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. But David’s weren’t healthy in there. But yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

But that’s still very singular. mindset. Yes. And so. And we tend to feel really, really comfortable talking to people like us. But the real I don’t know, challenging expansion is talking to people not like us. And that is just like,

 

 

wow. and nervous system in that place.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Oh, absolutely. Because you’re actually stepping outside of your comfort zone. Yeah. You know,

 

Bryn Edwards 

threatening our safety, who we are. Our belonging, our dignity to do and that switches and then it’s, yeah, that nervous system closed down.

 

 

Totally.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. I’m off to my moral high ground and judging you, comparing you I’m doing all the things make me feel safe now.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And as soon as we do that, we disconnect.

 

 

Correct.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right? Round theory is about connection of everything. Because at an energetic level, we are all connected all the time. Yes. And it’s only in our mind that we’re in this high ground. Yes. But it disconnects us. Which then impacts

 

 

also we think,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

or Yes, yes, totally, we think but

 

 

something to show on the other week. He was very clear with me about even when you feel disconnected from spirits, spirits always with you. Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yes, exactly. But we can, like, consciously we disconnect, unconsciously, we’re still connected, right? So that we can actually disconnect our actions from our thinking, well, even within our actions we could, and you’ll know people that will say one thing and do another. Yes, that’s a distraction is not in alignment. And then, you know, people will think something, they’ll say something, but that’s not how they actually feel. And we just go down the layers until we get to this energetic level, which is where this all sort of sits.

 

Bryn Edwards 

This calls me. Right?

 

 

Should we go into these? Are we ready?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

I don’t know. Do you feel like you’re ready? Yes. All right. So the three rounds? Yes, I have defined them as round one. Yeah. Everything with form and substance. Right. That’s everything we can define. Right. And that’s in the here and now in reality, right. I commonly call that our everyday reality. Yeah. Right. Round two. Is everything with four with no substance? And everything was substance with no form. Right. And All right. All right. So the things that have form and no substance is energy is one of them. electrical energy, you can’t hold on to it. Yes. We can see the impact of it. But it actually has no substance.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So does that have

 

Roslyn Snyder 

it has Form form. But well, when we measure it we can get away for

 

 

you can get it has no substance.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

It has no substance. Yeah. And why is nothing? Yeah, there’s no mess, right?

 

 

So similar simultaneously, there are things that have no form

 

Roslyn Snyder 

of substance. This is a really interesting one. So

 

Bryn Edwards 

are we now in that negative space?

 

 

Yes.

 

 

am I creating that?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, we’re in the negative space. So in quantum physics or not, it’s not actually, it’s universal physics, where they’ve actually discovered by calculation that there’s a mass in the universe where we can’t define. Right? In round theory, I’ve actually used the word holy to describe it. And I’ve chosen that word in front of physics and stuff like that, that central dark energy, dark matter. There’s lots of lots of different names for it. I’ve actually chosen to call it holy, from Aristotle back 2000 years ago, and he described fully as the substance in our brain. That’s not thoughts. Right. Right. And then another researcher, also, who was wrote a book about the history of the mind, he talks about holy, and because I’m a psychologist, that sort of fits. Yeah, as I’ve called it, holy energy.

 

 

Yep. cooling

 

Bryn Edwards 

and holy. Okay, so that’s the second round. That’s the second round on me back into the first one that so

 

Roslyn Snyder 

that’s everything with form and substance together.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So that’s like the universal set.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yep. That’s this last the water in it. The table? You may. Yeah. But your thoughts? energy.

 

 

Right. So that’s when we go to run.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

But where you’re a whole person? Yes. And if we took all the electrical out, yeah. You don’t exist?

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

All the energy out?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. So now we’re talking.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And that’s what I say. We have to consider the different frames of reference simultaneously.

 

 

Yes.

 

 

So um, yeah. Wait,

 

 

I’m just electrical impulses. Well, technically, yes. But not.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. Or, you know, I’m just this physical form.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Well, you’re not just the physical form the electrical stuff going through? Yes. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. So in. So an example of the holy is something that we can’t has an iPhone. So if you think about dreams, right? Have you ever had a dream where you’ve woken up in the morning and you are either furiously angry? or sad? Yeah. That’s an example of the holy it has substance because it’s impacted you? Yes. But it has no form. We can’t grow. Here’s your brain. It’s throughout now. Yeah. So and round two is jewel. So everything in round two is draw because of this. Jazz in two sides? Yes. And so we have energy and holy above and below. And the above and below are just terms to signify it’s above or below everyday reality. Right, really. But it’s because, like, realm, one, time is linear. And space is three dimensional. In round two, yep. Time and space, expand and contract. Right. So have you ever had the experience of driving somewhere? And it’s taken six times longer than you thought it should? Yeah. Or that and this or that? It’s done. Done?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yep. Right. And similarly, you can take substances which do that for you

 

 

totally.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. That you know, it’s 1am in the morning.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. Yeah. So and in other cultures, so my daughter in law’s Indonesian and they have a saying over there that times elastic. Yeah. So, so much of their life is actually in round two, where so much of our life is in round one. Yes, we have time times linear. We have schedules we have this and it actually distracts us from round two.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Which is everything well form without substance or substance without for the other part of realm. If you so I would say like the the joy Reality is like the duality between quantum physics and the collective unconscious.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Right?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So the crowd, the quantum physics is the energy, the collective unconscious is the holy. Right. And so I’ve read and this is from another book, there’s a psychologist, researcher prepper prepper. And he’s, he’s written, his whole research is for the last 20 years of his life is about holonomic brain. Right? Which is how everything’s connected. But everything is within everything else. Yes. So he wrote this board fractal. Yeah, it’s a fractal. Yes. Yeah. So he wrote this book about the brain and been. And in there, he’s interviewed a quantum physicist. Well, there’s just this little bit. And they discussed that the further you go into psychology, the closer you get to quantum physics, and quantum physics, physicists said the further in you go for quantum physics, you get to the consciousness. Right. And this is the round two. Part. Yeah, so this.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Certainly when you talk about Holi, and dreams, yeah. And then, through my knowledge of reading, you’ll get into the collective collective and we get into archetypes. Yes. The den alight.

 

Roslyn Snyder  

Yep. And then metaphors fit into there as well.

 

 

Yes. Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And our stories. So, you know, our

 

Bryn Edwards 

archetypes only seem to illuminate when some energy hits it hits it, because they’re dominantly. Yeah, exactly. Ring very

 

Roslyn Snyder 

well, we don’t. Yeah. And it only activates. When energy is set. It’s actually the other way around. Because holy is the pattern that energy must follow.

 

 

Oh, and that’s how we got into?

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So yeah, Holy is the pattern that the energy must follow. So the holy is like a blueprint in us that the energy must follow. And so if we get imprinted in a really negative way, our energy follows that.

 

 

What so if we take on somebody else’s or an external blueprint?

 

 

Yes.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Which, then that’s when we can have a disconnect. Yeah. And was true nature. Totally. So if we now go back to if I’m racing around. So if we now go back to my whole poll around that age between 37 and 42, the way I’ve described that, is that it’s almost a realignment period, where where two things, do things start to come crashing in and in on themselves. One is all the stories that we’ve picked up from everybody else. Whether it’s mom, dad, best friend, teacher, careers advisor, and then onwards from there, society, etc, etc. You get to a place where you’re like, well, I’ve done the thing, but I’m not getting the result. And it’s not quite and also, it’s leaving me feeling hollow. Yeah. But then there’s another really important part, which is where I’ve described it is that it’s roundabout 30, what I’d say is 3536. Before this is the apex of the individual power, yes. Which is where we’ve defined this identity based on I am this, not that, that not this, and then all of a sudden, you know, so I’m good, I’m not bad, I’m generous, I’m not stingy these things, and that’s when we’re pushing our shadow away. And, and denying part of our true nature and then all of that stuff, that you’ve chopped into boxes, and chucked into the, you know, down below and it starts to stinking up the joint all of a sudden goes in time. Yeah, we wanted some time to shine and you come out and then you start acting in very strange ways. And all of a sudden, things that reported yesterday are no longer important today. Yeah. And and, and to me, it all just kind of made sense. Now, it’s still difficult to that’s that’s the best of my articulation. Right? Yeah. Now there’s this sort of, you know, if they’re part of if there’s, so we’re from understand you if they’re almost him. imprints of blueprints of who? That is diverting energy. Yes. And at the same time, we’re only forcing energy into parts of our blueprint but denying other parts of our yep thing, then there’s going to come a point where, where the whole of the imprint goes right? To the external stories, and this energy is flowing through all of me good, bad or indifferent, but that’s your judgement opinion. This is just who you are.

 

 

Yes.

 

 

So right

 

Roslyn Snyder 

now is that Yeah. Well, yeah, that’s, that’s, yeah. It’s having the imprint of someone else. That leads you to not living your true die. Yes. Yeah. Right. And it happens so subtly and easily. And it can be as simple as a he’ll just like your father. Oh, yeah. And you’re growing up. Or you’re, you’re this. And so many people try to define what you are. So I was really good at math. Yeah, I was really great at computer programming. And my lecturer in computer programming was just like, you would make the top computer like, he was actually stealing my programmes to teach you because I would just look at him go, Well, that’s not who I am. I’m not trying to sit and be a computer programmer. That’s, but they couldn’t see that. Similarly, my son was very good at math. But he was also really good at drama and stuff. But this teaches type science, or you can be a doctor, you can be a doctor. He has absolutely no inkling about health, medical, like it was. It was so far from who he was. And I’m like, why can’t you teach us say that? But it was based on our grade? Yes. And that’s, and so people don’t see whole people. Right. And it happens in all walks, all levels of society and everything. We also have, and you touched on it about the story, but the story of our family. So it can be generational. That’s passed through. And we we see repeating patterns in families. Yes. And that’s part of that. That the holy that’s been passed on? Yeah. And because it’s when we give the story meaning.

 

 

Yes. Is that when we give

 

Roslyn Snyder 

glory? Yes. And then it manifests?

 

Bryn Edwards 

And then it comes to Rome? One. Yeah. And it

 

Roslyn Snyder 

and it manifests, and then we do the things we would never have done that. What did I do that?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. And then you can’t negotiate just

 

Roslyn Snyder 

like your dad, you know? Yeah. And

 

 

all of that.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. So so that’s round two. So then round three,

 

Bryn Edwards 

you just want to before we hop into out there as a question that like, I don’t know how to articulate it, but there’s some we overstating the role of passing genetics.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So genetics have energy and hollein. Right. So every, this pattern is in everything. So it’s in the cell, it’s in the genetics, it’s in? Right. us in our families in the system, it’s in everything.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Right. Okay, cool. Can you see where? Because we often go always past the jeans from our personnel. Listen to my own.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, but the the jeans are here, because everything has energy. Holy. Yeah. And all of that in

 

 

right. Now around three.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Okay, so round three. Is everything with no form. And no substance.

 

 

No form and no substance. Right.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So that is time.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Right? Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

space? Yep. And the third one of this, I’ve called on nyati. Yeah. Which just means everything with no form and no substance. That’s not time or space.

 

 

Do you give me an example?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

No, because I don’t know what it is. Right. But so in theory, there should be everything that has no form and no substance. That’s not time and space. There’s also not time and not space,

 

 

and not space. It’s exciting to even consider.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And that’s how, you know, so if someone discovers something else that has no, that’s part of the on nyati.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. What’s the origin is the word on nyati? Ah,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

well, it was often used. As in universe, God wrote all of that. But I didn’t want it to have a religious thing is just something that’s like, yeah, yeah. Like that. Yeah. And so now, I said, round two was draw this round is actually triple. Yeah. Sorry, actually, this is. I’m trying to think of a concrete example. So in here, time, is actually infinite. Right. Space is infinite. And so, yeah, so have you heard of string theory? brain theory? So they, they talked about infinite dimensions? Yeah, that’s where this comes in. This just grows forever. Yes. And? Yeah. And it’s in this one, it’s here. There. While for spice, it’s here, there and nowhere. Yeah. For time, it’s here there and know when? Yeah. And for the Omnia. D it’s here there and know why.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Right. So they’re all here in there. Yeah. And then No, why is there’s no.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

There’s no reason for Yes.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So there’s no time,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

which is no when

 

Bryn Edwards 

no one, so your time, and there’s no nowhere.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So in the beginning, I said there’s three rounds, and then three worlds. So that’s, technically there’s actually like nine, round nine worlds in round three, because it’s a three by three by three. Well, actually, it’s

 

Bryn Edwards 

  1. So there’s 123. And then

 

Roslyn Snyder 

  1. Yeah, because it’s a three by three by three.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. Right, as so that’s where the complexity comes in. Yeah. But if you want to do stuff in the everyday reality, we have to consider those other ones within this here. So we have to consider it within the class with a new.

 

 

So how would we do that?

 

 

So

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So with the new drug, this is the area that I work in. So for instance, with someone with post traumatic stress disorder, right, the times distorted. They relive the event from previous then. But from then not here, not here. Yep. Which is there. Yeah. But then there comes to here.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So we actually have to switch them back to

 

 

my here stays here. And my dad goes there. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. So. So that’s similarly with the energy, right. So often people with depression have decreased energy. Right. So that’s around two issue, not around one issue.

 

 

Right.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And so then we have to identify the root cause of the no energy. So is it a physical illness? Yes. Right. Because often I get people referred to for depression. And I’m like, and, you know, I’ve had people actually be diabetic. Yeah. And other things. And I’m going well, it’s not that low energy because they’re diabetic. Yeah, right. But we look at is there too much, like, basically too much holy and not enough energy, that sort of balance. Right. So in round two is about getting balance and harmony, right. For you to, to function well in your life. And round one is where we identify things that have happened in the past or what your what your life looks like. Right? And then the impact of the energy and holy, that influenced that. And then look for the time distortions or space distortion rounds, right?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. Right. It’s beginning to come to me. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And so, but before you can do any of that, the number one thing is for all to be combined is the relationship between you and me. We can’t do anything until we’ve got a relationship. Right. Right. And then therapy, it’s called the therapeutic relationship. Yeah. In business, that’s called business relationships. You have to actually have that relationship. Before anything really happens.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. And if that’s not in place,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

yeah. And the relationship is built on all three rounds?

 

 

Yes, yeah.

 

 

So it is.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

It’s, it’s quite difficult to explain in a linear fashion when it’s so nonlinear.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. And you said something to me, just before we started this recording, which was you always have to build the mindset to meet the theory.

 

 

Yes.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Which as you said before, is that a form of brainwashing?

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And I would argue No, because what we do isn’t about teaching you how to think or what to think or anything like that. Or way dove with the work I do is connect you to your nature, place and purpose, which is connecting you to your part, your place in the whole pattern.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right. Because I can’t see the patent from your point of view. No, because I can only Yeah, I can only see it from here. Yeah. Right. So it’s no good me. And so brainwashing. And all that is me teaching you my patent.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

That’s useless to you.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Again, we’re about to imprint this whole. Yeah,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

exactly. And yet, so much of our teachings are exactly that imprinting, imprinting. And it might not work for you. Right. So it’s connecting to your core nature, that allows me to see what things I would do with you to open up and for you to connect to your truth.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So instead of this, I have a theory of how your lashes out, not at all upon it. Now it’s more a case of being curious about the energy patterns, the maker preview, and co exploring that. Yes, then we can open up possibilities. Yes. So if I do introduce anything, it’s because I’m co exploring, and I’ve just had an idea that might open something.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And so it isn’t about one size fits all at all. Right. And so a lot of the things we get people to do experiential. So we might do a task, which might be something like paint anger, for instance. And then it so everyone’s anger would look different. Yeah. Right. And then write a poem about it. So it’s connecting into your deepest unconscious, which is not mine. Right. Although, having worked as a psychologist for so long, there are common patterns. Yes. Right. And, you know, there’s been a lot in the pipe for about, like domestic violence and that you can pick Well, I can pick that pattern really easily. And so I know what questions to ask people so that they can see what’s going on.

 

 

Yes. All right.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Whereas if I just said, are, you’re in a domestic violent relationship, they don’t know. We’re not

 

Bryn Edwards 

as opposed to surface it for themselves. Yes. So often, many of us been in the middle of something. When somebody comes in last year question, you suddenly realise this is not right.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

It was like when you asked me a question yesterday, when we had that chat on the phone, It was like, oh, wow, I hadn’t thought of it in that way. And that was in terms of like, because we’re talking a little bit about complexity theory and how that fades in. And that’s when I really thought, Wow, we really have to develop our minds to be able to see complexity. Yes. And when all our education and all our focus and everything throughout our life is to look within, right, and reduce and reduce down, which is analysis to find out how it works, where it’s now time for synthesis, yes, we need to synthesise the knowledge together.

 

Bryn Edwards 

It’s interesting, because if you so I’ve gotten a debate with somebody who pulls experts can link them to the news, and help them to put their message out. And it struck me that we, the definition of an expert was somebody who could drill down into it yet, and you know, that is put on a pedestal, because people have many letters after their name, because the more or less they have the more finer into the into the reduction they’ve gone to. Yet, what struck me is that we seem to lack lateral experts, if we even want to call them an expert. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And that’s so true in so many areas. And so I worked in suicide prevention, youth suicide prevention A long time ago. And I remember being at this meeting, and this politician came up to me and said, so how do we solve the youth suicide problem? And I said, well, it’s, it’s quite complex, because there’s a says, I don’t want to hear that. I just want one thing that I can do now to fix it. And I just looked at him or walked away, because there’s not one thing, because every single person is different. Yes, people experience life differently.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yet, I’ve spoken about this frequently, yet, we are conditioned to look for the one thing, sales and marketing is based on the one thing or the three secrets to or do this, and in eight weeks, but life just does not work that way. Now there is interrelated and complexity in the last 1218 months has shown us anything, and shine a bright light of energy through the hooli.

 

 

Exactly,

 

Bryn Edwards 

is the interconnectedness of everything of how we work, you start one thing, and then another problem arises and another problem arises and another problem arises. And, and so this is, I think this is why it’s come to the fore for me, because I’ve been through this almost like unsure denial type phase. And that is I know this, this is serious now. And then it leaves you wondering, is there been an individual reduction expert is useful, then how do we connect that? And I think one of the alphabet now, but one of the challenges I have felt is our response to many of the things that have happened over the last 12 to 18 months have have been stuck around the individual reduction viewpoints and is left me thinking one of the grown ups gonna turn up. Yeah, where did the Where are the adults with a sense of perspective across all of this? Yes, it looks like the elders, when they get a turn up and go, alright, boys and girls, right? Yeah, this is going to be difficult. And we are going to have to take some comfort and some risk and and, and something over here. But for the better good and how this connects, and this, that the other. And, you know, I had a had a chat with a young gentleman only last week about the period between 37 and 43. And one of the first things that caveated it with was this may trigger you. And he asked why? And I said because in order to listen to what I’ve got to tell you, you have to recognise that I am older than you. And with that comes some more experience. And so I have done stuff you’ve not and this is not some like I’ve run a business or something. I’ve just been through this life thing and have explored the stories of others. And we don’t like doing that anymore. You know since the 60s in the postmodern radio stick Yeah, man. Yeah, kick back.

 

 

Yeah, so you know

 

Bryn Edwards 

We seem to have mistaken growth and power hierarchies and smash them both down. Yeah. Where growth hierarchies, they still go on and they have merit. And the big argument that a lot of our culture was at the moment Ah, because all the different parts are all arguing that their place is better than the other one. We’re not just going to go do like 10 grand in 16 years time, you’re going to look at this differently.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And that’s the, I suppose the difference between competitive hierarchies? Yeah. where everyone’s competing for that one top spot? Yeah, yeah. And circular collaboration, where everyone’s valued for their contribution to it. And no one person has all the answers

 

Bryn Edwards 

yet now. Really. We’re in another time talking about collective knowledge, collective wisdom, and the idea of distributed cognition amongst different people.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And, you know, there’s one

 

Bryn Edwards 

part of that pattern. Yeah, the past that exists is a fractal.

 

 

Yes.

 

Bryn Edwards 

But we can’t execute all of it. No, it is.

 

 

Not at all.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And, you know, we often talk about we are one on one. But we are one on one. And we are part of everything. But we still have our part to play. Yes. And it’s, it is lateral. There isn’t the hierarchy that’s that we seem to live under that, you know, this person is better than this person, because they’ve got more money, or they’ve got longer hair, or whatever it is. We have these hierarchies in everything. And what do they actually serve? You know, what do they serve? They serve the system of hierarchies.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And it’s really frustrating to have this when, you know, there are alternative ways. And it’s been shown time and time again, that these other ways work just as well.

 

 

Yeah. Give me some sort of examples.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

team sports. Yes. Right. That the team? You know, there’s been teams that have become world champions that have not had one single star in them.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right. That’s them all working together all knowing their job in that team. Yes. So each person knows their nature, place and purpose in that team. Right. Right. The coach knows the nature place,

 

Bryn Edwards 

and most people will have felt that if they’ve played team sports, yeah, because there’s times when it’s all harmonious, and everyone does that role. And there are times when there are a people who don’t obey overextend their role.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And then you get some people that, you know, when there is a star player in that team, and they become conceited about it, the team doesn’t support them anymore. Yeah. Even if they’re there. They’re not consciously doing it. Unconsciously they’re doing it. Right. And so that’s an example of when people work together. And it happens every time. There’s like a natural disaster. Yeah, even with private everyone works together. So

 

Bryn Edwards 

1998 I went to South America, I went to a place called mana Manzanita in Ecuador. And it was El Nino time. Yeah. And I went there at one point and went there a couple of weeks later with my father who came over and just as I left the river, the rivers were washing the bridges away this day, the electricity have gone off this came back 10 days later, and the electricity was still off and on the 11th day with electricity comes back on and all this stuff. And whilst most of us were like, Oh, that’s great, we can get a cold beer and stuff like that. I’m gonna play some music. They kind of enjoyed it but there were also at the same time most of the people who lived in that town small little further down the coast were quite disappointed. And as I spoke to this guy, cuz my Spanish was good enough, great, but he was like, well, when all the electricity starts when the bridges start this that the other then everybody puts their money to one side, and we just make food for one another. We chicken and rice and we play volleyball all day and we have such a laugh. And then when this comes back, then we will have to go back to these roles that separated

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So our house got destroyed in a tornado A number of years ago. Right? And it was, it was so surreal, but also quite amazing because all the fences in our neighbourhood went down. And so there’s neighbours that live behind us and all that, who I’d never met. We’re all congregated in the backyard every morning having our morning coffee. Yeah, like, everyone’s in their dressing downs and, and it was just so real. And then as soon as the fences drove back up, we’d go into our little worlds and off radar. You know, and people from, you know, the night had happened. We had someone from another neighbourhood coming around, and they’d cooked up. I don’t know, 30 kilos of sausages. with bread saying, is anyone hungry? Yeah, we had this group of like, five young men don’t know who they were at all. could say that. There was a whole pile of rubbish. And I just went and cleaned it up. And they just came in, cleaned it up, walked on to the next fire. How?

 

Bryn Edwards 

So the things that we’ve just described, how do we place that in there? Okay, so you read that we’ve just done so that we really pulled some nice stuff out there. Yeah. How do we place it in us?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

You know, while we have an individual nature, place and purpose, humanity has a nature place and purpose. Yes. And human beings nature is to be inquisitive. Yes. Emotional.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. All right. stuff.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Social and patient. While impatient, actually, we’re actually wired to be impatient. We want everything done yesterday. So when we live according to that, yeah, we grow. Right. Right. So that’s our nature. emotional, social, and impatient, socially impatient. Yeah. So that’s how human beings nature is that humans place is, as part of Yeah, in the web of life. Yeah, we’re no better or no worse than any other living thing. Yeah. And so when we start to think we’re more important than something else, we lose connection with our nature without, without web, you know? And so, and our purpose is as terrorists of the world. Right. Right. And so when a natural disaster comes, we do all those things. Yes, automatically. We care. We care without judgement, we patiently

 

Bryn Edwards 

fix things we get emotionally driven, and we get inquisitive.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, on how to do it better. And we care for one another.

 

 

Yes. Right.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

But when we’re separated, that’s where the fragmentation comes in. And we start to be distrustful of everyone.

 

Bryn Edwards 

You know, so is that what drives that fragmentation? Then is that almost like this? In printed hooli?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, probably because we’re actually and taught to fear others.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. So it’s almost like this. Self perpetuating. Yeah. entity thing. That is, you know, because I have. So here’s a great example. Right? So it’s easy for those. It’s easy if you want to drop into other conspiracies, and this is right. Yep, queue drops, all that sort of stuff, right. To go. There is a small amount of people running the world. Right. And yet, I, and I considered that for a while yet. For me, it strikes me and one of our podcast, guests put it really nicely, like, let’s just take consumer capitalism, right. Yeah. Really sort of birthed after the Second World War, particularly from people like Edward Bernays, he was the nephew of Freud. Yeah. And, and there is a route and as Richard put across the bridge was the guest. There’s a real Freud in nature in in consumer capitalism and, and, and an object fetishism which is, you know, I am lacking of a thing, I need to feel whole so I need to buy that thing and put it in me whether it’s an object training book or knowledge or whatever, or whatever it is now, so that was probably actively commenced in the sort of, like 50s 60s and that’s where we get stuff like you know, madman and the bad guys and stuff like that, which is awesome. And, but these things have gained the momentum right? Now those guys created something, right. And it’s powerful. And it was put into the world. But those guys are dead now they’ve gone. But this thing’s seeing, does that

 

 

stay legacy?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah, and this thing seems to continue to regain momentum, and just got bigger and bigger and bigger. So what you’re telling me when you tell me there’s a conspiracy is that there’s someone in the middle holding the steering wheel, I would grant that there are people who can knock it from one side to another, and people can serve it really, really well. But this thing’s out of control. Yeah. And I think that’s where I suddenly get to the point of where are the grownups who look at this and go boys and girls? You You’re playing a game? That’s not really. Yeah, we all need to just calm and farm. Yeah. You could say social media is another one, where it seems to be this entity. And we’ve witnessed that. I mean, certainly you and I, in our lifetime, we’ve witnessed that, you know, having a pre digital memory. we’ve witnessed this, not only the internet turning up, which is like one thing, but then the social media thing turn up.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Well see, when I was young, we didn’t even have television. They go. So yeah, we had, while we did technically have television, but I lived in new country area and television. Well, we only had electricity when we put on the generator. So it was like an hour a day.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So is this where so would we be interpreting this where you know, almost like these things are? Holy has been?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, but it comes down to. So the round theory is based on quantum chaos. Yeah, right. Quantum chaos has some very fundamental, scientifically proven, like principles. Right? And one of them is, like, don’t take more than you need. And when we violate any of those laws, right, any of them? we isolate, we fragment, and then we disintegrate.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah, that’s where we got a second law of thermodynamics time. Yes, exactly. a closed system will always disintegrate.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And if you want to look at it more, I don’t know. So have you heard of the term self organisation? Yes. Yep. So everything self organises? Right. Yeah. And so the self organisation of the Earth is far greater than the self organisation of humans.

 

 

Yes. Right.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So, you know, in what you’re talking about, we could argue that the self organisation of the Earth is creating this thing for us to isolate, fragment and disintegrate to remove the humans off the earth. So for the self organisation of the earth, because we keep just like destroy and part whatever. Right. So you could go that far. So there’s multiple levels, you could go to about this. And if we’re trying to find one simple, like, solution, my simple solution would be like, everyone just find their own natural place and purpose and live from there.

 

 

Yeah, yeah. gets it. If you reduce it. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. So yeah, so there’s multiple

 

Bryn Edwards 

waves by nature. With this.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. So there’s a collective nature, place and purpose of humans. Yeah. And then within that we’re all got our own nature, place and purpose. And, you know, within that our liver has a nature, place and purpose in our body. Like everything has its own nature, place and purpose within everything.

 

Bryn Edwards 

This is where Yeah, we get the different hormones.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, yep. Yeah. Yeah. And it just, but the really interesting thing, according to Rome theory, all of them will have the same core nature as you. So our liver will have the same core nature as our body.

 

 

Right? reset core nature.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. So that’s part of the energy pattern.

 

 

Right?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

They’ll all be connected. And each of them will be a reflection of the universe. I don’t think you’d quite got to that part on the paper. But that’s alright. So it does. You know, the more you get into it, the more there is,

 

 

yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And once a day, that’s from my perspective, from my part in the pattern, that’s what I say. But you might get there and go Well, let’s start. Well, I say, I’m like, okay, yeah. So and so you do what you say I do what I say, and I rahmer about that.

 

Bryn Edwards 

There is, even if I not even if I, if I dial back out of this conversation and take some of the even some of the some of the core basic things about us being connected, and having our own role. I mean, the very nature of the fact that we know that we’re all different, yet we’re all remarkably similar. Yeah, you know, the, the 8020 rule probably stands. Yeah, 80% completely the same. 20% different, despite the fact like we like to overextend that 20% nowadays, there’s just

 

 

even if you sit and just sit with that, and let it sink in,

 

 

it really

 

Bryn Edwards 

is quite calming.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. So you know, I often say life is actually really simple. Any Amoeba, which is a single cell organism lives, as humans have complicated that so much that we’ve lost, how to live. And so, for instance, we have an obesity epidemic. That’s because we’re eating more than our body needs. Right to our nature. Yeah. You know,

 

 

we’re on tape. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right. You know, some of us don’t even breathe properly. A lot of it? Well, there’s pollution for one, but also we don’t use our body, how it was designed to be used. And there’s just so many things like that. Right. So recovery

 

Bryn Edwards 

over with bullshit stories. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And we say it’s genetics, or it’s this medication, like, bottom line is we’re talking more than we need. Or, you know, we’re thinking we’re better than someone else, or less than someone else. And that creates a lot of the social issues.

 

 

Yes. Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right. Because we walk down the street, we see a homeless person. And we tend to ride

 

 

along with people with the advent of

 

Bryn Edwards 

I like to test and play with stuff. With the advent of modern medicine, and hospitals, and life support mistakes are in danger of taking more life than we need.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Possibly, yeah. Possibly.

 

Bryn Edwards 

You know, yeah. Cuz you can you put this into the whole COVID and vaccine place? Yeah. Yeah. Do we actually need that? Or do we

 

Roslyn Snyder 

allow people to die out? Yeah. then that becomes a very ethical question. Because it’s fine on a global level, or yet, our population is this, we need to reduce it by 20.

 

 

until it comes to your granny. Exactly. Your mum, yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Because for you, those people are more important than other people.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

But on the big scheme of things, everyone’s actually have equal, like, have equal value. And so if we live like that, but it’s interesting on that thing about the medical and, and that, so we have people making decisions that allow people to die, or live now. And it was really interesting, because people, this is going back to my time, working with hospitals, and having the hospital board to set the parameters because people say our doctors need to do it and all that. But they’ve actually found that if you lay out all the facts for people, so they’re brought this amount of money, right, whatever that money is, do we use it to save this 105 year old? Or do we use the money to save five children? Most adult people can make those sorts of decisions on where the money drugs. Yeah. Right. But then we might get political. Yeah. And then it gets just goes on and on. But this person and you know, and all of these are violations of quantum pay. So then the natural laws of the universe. And so, you know, we just need to live those.

 

Bryn Edwards 

You can see how So the list soaking this up that when you consider identity politics and identity issues, that we really are just wrestling with it if somebody genuinely identifies as one thing or another. But at another level, it’s it’s, there is a natural law. Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yep. And that’s why Shawn describes himself as a human being. Yes. And people go, but why don’t you describe yourself as an Aboriginal man? Well, yeah, but I’m a human being first.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And, you know, and other, you know, before that we’re a living entity. Yeah. Yeah.

 

 

Bringing it out.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And we, you know, and if we look at the world that way, like, we’re all human beings. You know, we develop that compassion, compassion and empathy for the other person. But if we identify as were these, automatically, it sets up and us in them. Yes. Which then divides us?

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So we have divisions through race and sex and bike riders and car drivers. Yeah, so a lot official. And, you know, if we just remember that. And, you know, that’s why I can walk in and sit like this with a person that’s murdered someone. Or I can walk in and sit like this with someone that’s created a new album of music. Everyone is just equal.

 

 

So yeah,

 

 

that’d be very triggering.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Absolutely. And, you know, sat there with child molesters? Yeah. You know? And if we truly believe we are one on one. I’m not saying everyone has to do that. But someone has to treat them as people.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Otherwise, we make it worse. It’s like what you started with with the shadow side? Yeah. As soon as we separate from our shadow. we’d give it more power. Yes. When we separate from criminals and stuff, we give them more power. And so that’s part of that whole fragmentation, and, and it just recreates itself.

 

 

Far, huh.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Very much, very much. Does it get for us to rating when you see this happening? You see the patterns in the world, yet? You see them being the same errors being replicated and replicated?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

That’s a fascinating question. I’d like to say No, I don’t. Because if I’m really this, that’s what needs to happen. Yeah. I can’t control that.

 

 

Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

But I do get frustrated. Yeah.

 

Bryn Edwards 

And there’s, you know, there was this recipe lesson as to what to do something and have an impact and change and move things.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yes. And, but I think what frustrates me more is people will contact us and say we, we need to change this because it’s not working. Right. And I’ll give you an example. An organisation that works with Aboriginal people. Right, says we can’t keep Aboriginal employees. So we go, okay. And they said, Can you help us? And we’re like, yeah, we can do that. And we went in. And we actually interviewed some Aboriginal people that worked for them. We came back and said, your organization’s not actually culturally safe for them. And they turned around and went, yeah, we know that. I said, Well, isn’t that what you want us to do? I said, No, we want you to make them fit in with us. that frustrates me.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Because that absolutely dismisses the needs of that person. Right. they’re required to employ Aboriginal people because all their clients are Aboriginal. But it’s not safe anyone. So it’s it’s actually damaging. that frustrates me.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. Same people been damaged. By decisions have a few.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. And I guess that’s, that’s what we feel when we see. Yeah. People in senior roles and organisations, particularly for government and beyond.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. But even Yeah, even even the person making decisions. So, you know, going to stall, the person at that front desk has a huge impact. So if you go to enrol your child, yeah. And they don’t want to pay you any attention. You don’t want to send your child into that place. Yeah. And then you get accused of keeping your child at home, but you’re going, it’s not safe for my child there. Yeah. Right. And so this is, you know, where there’s one way, one way school should be one way. Psychologists should be one way business consultants should be? Well, that’s just bought it, it is. And we need to be a lot more flexible. To allow people to be people

 

Bryn Edwards 

and then allow patterns to emerge.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right. And, you know, we’re, I’ve talked about the core energy pattern. So I know that based on this realm theory, that, you know, about, one in eight people will get me and the work we do 100%, they’re like, pull another three out of eight, so 50% of the population will be really comfortable with what we’re doing. Another 30% will be like, Oh, it was probably working for some, and then there’ll be 10% that go on a leadership. Yeah. And that’s simply based on the energy pattern, because it just means that we’re less connected to that person. Yeah. Yeah, it’s three sections away. Yeah. And that, and I can accept that. You know, and so, but if all systems are based on this model, you’re only ever going to serve at most 50% of the population. Yes. No matter what it is

 

Bryn Edwards 

a thought. It’s interesting, because I have a felt sense that I’ve investigated in others, that there’s a there’s a growing emergence of feeling that many of our systems and and and what have you was originally had the good intent of protecting small minorities. Now hold the majority to the ransom, or hold them in the the, the policies and procedures and the rules down here, and then that extrapolates further, which means that people go well. Okay, I can see how these group of people get certain dispensers. dispensations for, for being like this. Okay, I’ll go and I’ll go and present like this, to like this to get this place. And, you know, I got dragged to the family courts for two, three years. And that’s, yeah, yeah. And there was a lot there, but it frustrated because here I am trying to just almost dare I say rationally. Okay, well, what do we need to do? Either we need to move on. And there are many others. Right. Do we agree to disagree, but there’s another or what have you. But But you’re stuck in having to play this game? Which doesn’t seem to go anywhere? Yeah. Does that make sense?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Totally. And because that system isn’t serving the actual needs of the people, and the one that I said, humans are emotional, yeah. Right. So in family court, there’s a lot of emotion thrown out. Yeah. Right. And so if the system doesn’t allow you to be emotional, or you don’t have a way of processing that emotion, you use the system to manifest it.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So if you’re emotionally stuck, you want the system to be emotionally stuck. Yes. If you’re, if you are really angry, you want someone to be punished.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yes. Right. And, and so the system doesn’t actually serve the needs of the people. It serves the needs of the system.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. I met someone recently who is developing a piece of software for mediation dispute resolution, particularly in the family court, and I just said to him, Thought is going to create far more mental health problems than you would ever imagine. And I just implicitly knew.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, because you’re only looking at the actual process. Yeah. Not the emotional process,

 

Bryn Edwards 

you get the opportunity to go in there and get emotional. That’s gonna go somewhere else. Yeah. And that’s somewhere else could well be productive to the rest of society. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And so we actually need in all the systems to look at the humanity within the systems. And so many of our systems are, have exclusion policies. which make people feel bad. Right? The classic one is our mental health system.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So if you have a mental illness, but you also self medicate, with alcohol or drugs, because of that mental illness, you try to get service at the mental health service. And they will say, your primary issue is alcohol and drugs. We can’t serve you. But then you’d go to the alcohol and drug service, and they grow. But you’ve got a mental illness, we don’t have the ability to

 

 

fix that

 

Roslyn Snyder 

help with that we can help with the alcohol and drugs, but we can’t help with that. They’re interrelated. And so we have this system of exclusion, which goes against the laws of, of nature for human beings isolate, and then we fragment and, and it just goes on. The other thing is, you know, the mental health system only sees serious mental health conditions. Right? If you don’t meet that criteria, where do you go? And your mental health issue might be really detrimental to your family. Right, causing all sorts of problems at work. But it’s not serious enough. What does human nature do you make it worse? Because you want help here, you’ll

 

Bryn Edwards 

come back 12 months later? And it is yeah. And burnt scorched path in your way?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. So you know, if all our systems were based on realm theory, which is really about human life, like

 

Bryn Edwards 

life, so how would mental health provision look like in Roseland? Because this is, this is really super interesting to me, because there’s, like, I’m going around trying to have coffee catch up to people who I know. And the biggest question I asked at the moment is, who is dealing with the biggest questions in Western Australia? Like, where are we going? How are we developing the human capabilities to to face volatile, uncertain, complex ambiguous situations, how we actually embedding how we actually even sit in, in complexity, learning to connectedness, and, and, and allowing things to emerge solutions to emerge? Rather than sitting in it for a couple of minutes? And then going, it’s this plan, a load of L funded money onto it, and nobody can help me? Yep. It’s presented as its triggering and scary. Some people most most the people who I have these couches with some of our past podcast, guests will entertain me. Do you want to see me Get it? Yeah. But then it’s like, who is actually looking? So maybe that’s my restlessness of doing? Yeah. So back to what has mental health. That’s one of the ones Yeah, with my hypothesis of this is an appropriate response.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And and so we need Well, we need a multitude of alternative models, because the mental health system in wi at present is actually in very much a psychiatric

 

 

model. DSM.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, yeah. And it’s the psychiatrists are in like, they make most of the decisions, right. And it’s predominantly for people with schizophrenia, bipolar, and really, really, really severe depression, where they need not just medication right? They don’t do a lot. Like they have programmes here and there for things like borderline personality, they don’t have things for people that have dissociation and nonspecific things, because they don’t fit into a neat box.

 

Bryn Edwards 

from, from my experiences, a lack of proper acknowledgement of the impact of that cluster B personalities.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

There’s, there’s so much. And so if a person says they need help, an expert, shouldn’t we say no, you don’t? Which is how it feels for people. Yeah. And so, you know, so there needs to be a pathway that people feel like, they’ve got something.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And, and we don’t have, we sort of have the extreme acute area, we don’t have services for people with really chronic mental health problems. And they used to get a lot more service in hospital or hostile type thing level dominance. And they’re actually not safe for them in society, because they are then preyed on by a lot of organised crime stuff. And this Yeah, and so. And there’s definitely not very much on prevention. Yes. If anything at all,

 

Bryn Edwards 

funding goes to it goes to like, you know, beyond blue, and this, that the others, which is I’ll talk you down off the bridge.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, but not what to do then.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. Or what’s going on at the start of the process?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

No. And, you know, and they talked about prevention, when you’re already depressed, when you’re already having suicidal ideation. Yeah. Like, this is 10 steps back. And, yes, so we, you know, that’s where I’ve done quite a bit of work. And that’s so we still do is a community based system where we up still a number of community members, so that they, and it’s not a treatment at all, but they know what, not what the person needs, but they have the the knowledge and ability to go, Ah, that’s what you need. Like, these are, yeah, but not even a trick. But this is for prevention. Yeah, right. I’m not talking about people with serious mental illness. Yeah, I still. And that system works quite well. You go to the doctor, the doctor refers you on? Yeah. But you still have to have a diagnosable mental health condition. You know, that step before? There’s, like this, this big group of people that know things aren’t right yet. But they haven’t actually, it hasn’t developed fully into a fully blown

 

 

This, this,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

that’s the area that we need. And I,

 

Bryn Edwards 

what you’re describing now is, I came out of doing a bachelor’s degree between 1993 and 1997. At Reading University in England, it was interesting to one, it was an interesting experience. I did well in it, but didn’t flick my switch, it was dealing with what I refer to as top and bottom 5% society. And it’s this other bit, the middle bit, and it was like, we never really dealt with that. What are the patterns that go through life? What are the significant events? Yes, what to happen, you know? Why are we not normalising the fact that okay, you’re, you’re coming up to 37 shits gonna get real for you stuffs gonna happen. And then we talked about, there’s another one when you get sort of,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

but then there’s also the one when you leave stop. Yeah. When all of a sudden you’re supposed to be an adult.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah. And what are we talking about now? rites of passage, but they’re not just rites of passage. Right? The development phases.

 

 

Yeah, along.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And there’s this belief that once people get to this age, everything’s developed.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yeah, I think off the top.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

But it goes on, and there’s developmental things and is in that level. We, we need the more holistic stuff.

 

 

Yes. To understand patterns,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

we need to ask understand also that the school system doesn’t suit all children. Right? Or this work environment doesn’t suit all people. And so if you come back to if you know your nature, place and purpose, you can much easier no way you’re going to fit.

 

 

Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right. Yeah. And so there’s a thing in and I just love it every time I hear Shawn or one of the other elders talk about it. It just, I’m like, Yes, that’s what we need to be doing. So at present our system is you’re going to education at three or four. Right? And it starts to become like this. And the Aboriginal what I was kids up until about nine or 10 had no law, no formal anything. They were actually observed.

 

 

Right.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And they were observed by the elders, that other family members and be going, huh, he’s showing this, and it’s consistent over time. Yeah. And so let’s develop that.

 

 

Right. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Whereas we tend to put people in little boxes that are pre determined, almost, and it actually destroys peace. You know, all kids are so inquisitive.

 

 

Yeah. very social.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

They’re very social, believing. They’re emotional. And if we nurture that, yeah, but what happens when we get to my son’s a school teacher, he went out on prac, there was a little kid, little child, I think it was seven or eight years old. And their brother had just died. And a kid came up crying to the teacher, and the teacher said to her, I’ll get over it, he died three weeks ago, get back to your desk. Right. And it’s like, so whereas, and I understand that teachers can’t do that. But when teachers have come through my training, our training, they have a different way of dealing with that. And so, you know, how I talked about we have arts on dance story and language. So they will just have over to the right, a table set up with art stuff. Yeah, if a kid is feeling struggling, their emotional is just like are you might need to stay on over there. And do some artwork for the next half hour when you’re ready to come back and join the class. And as that set up with no judgement, no discussion about what’s wrong, that just throws into the story. But it gives the kids a process to deal with the emotions. A very, very natural process, that there’s no big disclosure, like they just do it. And there’s no stigma attached to it. And so by the like, halfway through the year, kids will come in, in the morning and go, Miss, I need to draw, she’ll do that. And they just do that. And then come back and, and do that. So there’s these little things that we can do regularly with people without saying you must do this now. You just have that space for people to be and do what they need to do. Because one thing that it’s my work life has taught me if we create a space for people, they do what they need to do. Yeah. Which is that negative space?

 

 

Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And we don’t do that we give them we do this. And if we go, just sit there. So there’s so many things we can do. So many, so many things. And it doesn’t cost a lot doesn’t. You know, teachers have woven it through the curriculum. You know, you know, managers have who’ve done the training have just woven it into their workplace. Yeah. It’s not like it becomes this separate. Let’s learn about the song. This is just part of life. Yeah. Because all of this is just part of life.

 

Bryn Edwards 

It is and then we can go more gentle on ourselves. Yeah. It can be less stressful and anxiety provoking and all sorts. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So should we get on to those paintings?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Do we have? Yep, yeah. All right. So I have three paintings and each one of them is The different realm understanding. Yes. So this first one is round one understanding. Yeah. And so over here in this section here, yeah, you’ll see that the person’s black and white. Yep. This is that very simplistic thinking that you started telling me about, you know, you’re either good or you’re bad. Right? It’s right or wrong. Now, when we’re children, we need that simplistic. To learn right? from wrong. Yeah. With a little Bay here, we’re connected in. Right, we’re still connected. But our life, our world is quite small. We’re quite grounded. We’re quite safe. Yeah. Right. So this is a linear understanding of life, then we go into here, and our life becomes bigger. Yeah, right. But we’re actually not connected up here at all. And we’re not connected here. And then we go into this turmoil state. Right. But this is like our, our tree of knowledge. Yep. So this is it growing here, and then it gets bigger. And this is like, so this is getting bigger as well. And this is our connection to our nature, the natural world, really, but we’re sort of free flowing. And then we come over here. And this, our tree of knowledge has gone up to this much higher, higher level has gone through this, and this is our boundary. So this is your everyday reality. This is our everyday reality under here is is the below and in the below. There’s three substances of holy and one of energy, but we don’t really need that. And up here is the above, which has three forms of energy and one substance of holy. Right. And so we go through, and we eventually get here, and see the person is actually right here over on the right, very, right. There’s a dog person. And that’s actually connected to what’s been though. But that’s

 

 

like a monkey face.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

It’s actually like an owl, right?

 

 

Oh, yeah, it is actually.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And it’s an owl in a cave, which, which is quite interesting, because so my key to my power, yeah, in the end, is wisdom. And the owl represents wisdom. And so this is my journey. No, but the stages will be similar, but the parts will be different. And so this person here, who’s rolled over to the right, is connected to the now and as well as the growth and the energy source up here. Right. Now, this other person that’s up above, like the rainbow here, at the top, that person’s actually gold and white. Right? So they’re still got that duality thinking. But it’s not black and white. And this is, this is where a lot of people believe is where we need to get to. Yeah, but it’s above everyday reality. Yes. So this is the person that sees themselves as quite superior.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And that they might have. Yeah, and all of that. And they’re connected to this.

 

 

This isn’t like spiritual bypassing this. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, that sort of thing. And, and they look down at the world and come up with solutions that are based in reality. And, you know, this could be someone with extreme book learning, but no lived experience. Yes. So it’s great. In theory, it could be someone that’s developed this. I don’t know, Guru type, law life that doesn’t actually apply to real life. And this is, this is a spirit like. So these are both sort of like the spiritual. But we need the connection of the two sides. And so this is like a cat, but it’s not really a cat. But it just signifies, like a higher being

 

 

with this. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And you know, we have clouds and in the actual painting, it’s a little bit more three dimensional. And this part here is really rough. This when you’re going through here, you feel quite out of control. in lots of ways nothing makes sense anymore.

 

 

Yes,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

but we’ve got I think, too many people making decisions based from here.

 

 

Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. signifying simplistic thinking. And when I said earlier about the politician asking for one solution for suicide prevention, that’s what they’re saying. Yes. And a lot of our leaders are really free one dimensional. Yep. And they only see things from their own perspective of how they’ve grown up. Whereas here, you’re actually exploring a lot of different perspectives. So that’s the everyday reality. Linear. Your journey from left to right, right through life. And you know, and so that’s the, but this is the every because this is a linear life. But it’s also putting in the time and space within here. Yeah. And also the energy and wholly within these bits. Yes. So but it’s around my understanding, it’s very linear. It’s very stage orientated.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. You get that as your Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And you know, this is growing, this is changing. It’s evolving. So that is around one understanding, but combining everyday reality now, here and now. But we’re also considering round two and round three within this painting. Yep. Cool, right. And this is what I talk about is that I would never have learnt that understanding of round one until I painted it. And this was actually the first painting I’ve ever done in my life.

 

 

Yeah. And because just before the emotions,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

yeah, yeah. No, that was, yeah. But that was a drawing. This is a national painting. And it’s fascinating that when I paint, I always do it outside. And I always do it with my hands. Never use a brush, which is so unbelievable to me, because I hate anything on my hands. So I hate gardening, because I hate the soil. I don’t make pastry for the same reason. And yet, this is always done. And while I’m doing it, there is no time or space. I’m just so that’s the round one understanding.

 

 

It’s interesting.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Having delved into all the dreams previously with with a previous guest, Debbie really got the sense of just how interesting intrinsically personal dreams and the messages of them are. Yeah, so then to actually, you know, do a piece of art, then it helps. Yeah. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And so this is round to understanding. Yeah. And this little dot with the little dots around over on the right. represents Earth.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right. These three levels here represent the three Hollis black, the red and the yellow, mustard yellow. They represent the three Hollies below. You I talked about in the other painting, but you’ll see that the other dots are in it, because nothing is ever 100% pure.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So you have the other bits within that

 

 

is isolated.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yes. It’s all connected. Now, this is actually the the top left represents the source of energy. Yep. Right. And this line that curls all the rap across is like the life force. That is face. Yeah. So is the joining together of the energy and holy, which then

 

Bryn Edwards 

these are the

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, they’re sort of Yeah. And then the one up in the top left hand corner represents the energy. And it looks the same. Yeah, but it’s actually coloured dots. Yeah. But it’s actually the pure source of energy above, right. And they combined to give us our life force,

 

 

which is the

 

Roslyn Snyder 

line that goes across. And that lifeforce is part of our energy patent. Right? And so each one of us has a tiny, tiny little bit out of that. Here as as does the earth as does the other planets.

 

 

And what’s this little red thing?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

That’s my signature. It’s three fingerprints, right? Okay. So all my paintings have the three fingerprints, which represent and each one has three colours, which is realm theory. By the three by The three. So that’s around to understanding. Yeah. And then the third painting we have here,

 

 

yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

This way is around three understanding.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And this is the patterns of time and energy, time and space. And I’m nyati. So the lines that go in one direction, or represent lines of time. So there’s multi levels of time, and it continues on the ones this way, represents space spice. So once coming down, well, it does. Because it’s relative.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So yeah, okay.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And the brown dots at the cross points represent the here and now. Right? And the nature of that is where the everyday realities. Right, all these little dots that are all over it? Well, I should say the background, yes, is actually the holy and how that sort of, because holy can’t fly because it’s substance without energy without form. Alright, so it is just exists. So each one of the the same colour exists everywhere and is connected, but not in the hearing now.

 

 

Sounds good.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Okay. So each one of the colours in the background represents a different substance of holy, right. And everything that’s the same colour is actually connected, even if they’re separated? Yep. All right. And so that, and the dots really represent the energy. These bits that are on top. I don’t actually know what that is. But I know it’s critically important. And so as I develop my own mind, yes, I will understand this more.

 

Bryn Edwards 

What are these? Sort of?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah, but they’ve all got three colours in and it’s a different paint altogether. Right. So these are an enamel paint. This was all one acrylic paint, right. Which was, you know, because this leads into the synchronicity of it all. So I had been painting. And my husband went to the shop. And then he came back and he says, I, you need this. And he gave me these three enamel paints. And I looked at him, I went, What the hell are you doing? And then all of a sudden, it was on here. And so often, and this is, earlier on, we talked about the know why, yes. Sometimes we just don’t know why. Sometimes it just is. And that’s what this is. Yeah, there’s just a,

 

Bryn Edwards 

and Java says that they reveal themselves rather than just to sit there.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

I think they’ll reveal themselves. You’ll also notice that there’s three different colours of energy dotted line dotted lines. And like, this one has a source here, this one has a source here, and this one has a source down here, right. And they all come from different places. And so our entire world, our entire universe, is in one of these brown dots. Ah, and so that contains all of round one and two, like is in there. And so this is much wider. There are other dots. Yeah. Which is a whole nother

 

 

topic. Yes,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

very much so. And it just goes on and on, which is why it’s painted right to the edge. Yeah. And it just keeps drawing in. So

 

 

yep, small.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So these represent the time space continuum. Yep. But they cross over and we exist in the here on one of them. Right. And you’ll notice that if this is time, so this brand out in the middle is the here in time, either side is the there. Yes. So this is past and present a past and future in round one, but in round two, it’s expanding and contracting. Yeah, so the sides expanding that if this side expands, decide contracts, yes. But then in round three, the time is infinite. So all of it is existing simultaneously

 

Bryn Edwards 

Sure many of the things that we hear about playing with when we consider things like quantum mechanics, etc, etc.

 

 

Yes,

 

 

yeah. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Similarly with the line of space,

 

 

yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Sorry, the drawing. So that’s the three levels of understanding. Yeah. But it’s you can’t read the apply one without the other. Because they’re all interrelated. Yes. So you can observe something from around three perspective, around one and two is in there. Yes, you can observe from around to perspective, but round one and three is. This is one of the really interesting bit is that when you have round one, and round two, intersecting in the negative space is what creates round three. So they actually recreate each other.

 

 

Right? That’s good.

 

 

All right. So

 

Roslyn Snyder 

round one, the interaction between round one and two. Yes. Creates round three. The interaction interaction again, it’s it’s sorry, if we lose you as a thing. Yeah, here’s the thing. All right. So you was bring here? Yeah, this is your physical body. That’s here. And now? Yes. Within there is round toe. Yes. Your body and realm to have the energy and holy create round three? Which is time space?

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. Right. I say,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

right. Round one and round three together create the energy and holy. Yeah. Because the, the energy is in the negative space of time. And the holy is in the negative space of space. It’s so interconnected, yes. But when you really understand, and then it’s all how it all flows together, and how there’s a pattern that allows energy to flow exactly how it needs to. Then everything’s in harmony.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Last question, before I see the last question, I couldn’t finish it. Have you gone out and tested this? How have you gone out and almost verified it tested it? If you know what I mean? is one thing to say? Like, I have to say, if you have the, if you develop the mindset to understand it, but then.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Okay, so all my work has tested?

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

And so I use this in the treatment of mental health.

 

 

Right, right. Yeah.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right. And I use it in changing the structure and organisation of a company. Right. Right. Because once you understand the self organisation, and how everything goes together, you can create things to happen. I used it. So in really previous job. I was a manager of a division of general practice. And one of the things was to get GPS to follow best practice. In a whole range. The thing is, the doctors believe they’re doing it.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Right. Yep. So if you say, We want you to do this, they go, we’re already doing it. So nothing’s gonna change. Yeah. And so by using this, I worked out that and you to change a system, you need three, which is because of the three rounds, you need three people to come on to change the system. Yeah. And so what I did I put out that word, right. To get GPS to do an audit on one tiny aspect of one chronic condition. Yeah. Right. And we’re just randomly selected. Yeah. And we selected like 10 doctors out of the 120. And what we said is he or we’re going to do 10 JPS. And this one GP rang me out. By a waste of time. What are you doing? You know, I know I’m doing all this acid. All right? You do the audit, show me that you’re doing that. And then we don’t have to have any other discussion about it. Yeah. And so he went off and did it. Yeah. And what we were looking at was just for context was diabetes. Yes. Right. And the clinical guideline, say, you need to test their blood pressure every three months. They need to have this particular test every six months and this one once a year. And so what the theme was the next five patients You see, with diabetes, you just do a quick audit, or you give it to your receptionist to do an audit. Yeah. And he found that on, you know, three out of the five, he hadn’t done a blood pressure for a year. Yeah. And he was absolutely shocked. So he actually wrote a newsletter article, saying every GP should do it. Yeah. What happened every day? Not every, but they started. Yeah. And it changed the culture. Right, which also changed the culture, and Rosalyn has some ideas, then they started reaching out, or do you know how to improve this? Right? Typically, when we have a problem, we either hire more people or do something. But this teaches us to consider it in different

 

Bryn Edwards 

ways. Yeah. And when you understand doubling down on the problem, yes. Often our response to a problem is well, or to work harder. Yes, percent doubles the size of the problem, because you didn’t say,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

and I knew, all I needed was one GP to recognise. Because it’s human nature to believe that we’re doing a good job. Yeah. And you know, we’re doing most of the time, because what I wanted to implicate implement was a computer system that would actually pop up and say, this person needs, you know, so it would come up. And this was way before most repos had computers. So it was all. Yeah. But so there’s so many things we can do. Right? And so if you want to change the culture of an organisation you use, and we call it the power of three, and we get three, either three groups or three, whatever, what, from different parts of the corporation to actually go through and experience part of this. Yeah. And then they, and then the ripple effects go on to other people, yes. Because this, the self organisation of this person has changed. So then that impacts everyone else. So we do a lot of work with generational trauma. So, you know, and this was just last week, a woman rang me and Aboriginal woman had come to a training, because her workplace said she had to, and she came to assess whether our training was suitable. And so while she was in the training, I really felt like she wasn’t that involved or anything. She was questioning, like, and really didn’t share hardly anything of her life. And this is 18 months later, she’s rung me. I said, I just, she actually wanted to purchase a new job. Now. She wanted some other information. But she said that, I just want to tell you that what you taught me has changed everything in my life. Yeah. Because before I was so ashamed of what had happened to me, that no body knew, and I was just pushing it all down, and all of that. And then you made me, like, through the process, realised that it wasn’t my fault. It wasn’t this. And so she said, Well, then why am I carrying all this? So she was able, because we take three steps for is to acknowledge it, express it, and then let it go? And she said, No, it was actually really easy to let it go, because I had attached all this importance to it, which didn’t belong. But she said, But not only that, because I’ve done this. My kids are now

 

 

doing this

 

Roslyn Snyder 

doing this, and I haven’t actually told them anything. And you know, I have a brother that’s lived with me for the last 15 years and he’s chronically suicidal, and every day are married about him. She says, I just started speaking about her experience. She says and this way he’s gone and left and got a job. Right? And she says, so the energy has changed in that family, which has then allowed him to change without even doing very much at all.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Yes. Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

So there’s lots and lots of applications. And before I came here, I was talking to someone else. And they were asking me that very similar question. And so I’ve used it for human type stuff, right? I taught a few years back to an exploratory geologist who was really interested in and he said he wants to do it, so that he can see the patterns for oil exploration.

 

 

Right,

 

Roslyn Snyder 

which is totally not my area. Yeah. And then. So we have a programme called leaders without borders, which is a, it goes over three years. Seven, wait. So it’s two weeks in the first year, three in the second, two in the third, intensive weeks, to actually develop the mind to that level. And the people that were wanting to do it, finance, finances, because they want to see if I can use this for the money matters. Right, because everything follows this pattern. And but I don’t know that knowledge. Yes. I know, the knowledge of how, what experiences people need to develop that? Yes. So that’s what we give people is the experience so they can

 

 

find it themselves embedded for themselves

 

Roslyn Snyder 

and embed it for themselves. And then they can use all their substantive knowledge in their industry to, to align that industry, with, with the natural laws of the universe. It’s actually simple, huh? I know, like we’ve taught, you know, to actually develop your mind, you don’t actually have to understand all of that. Yeah.

 

Bryn Edwards 

What do you have to do? Because

 

Roslyn Snyder 

it’s have disrupt what for me? Because my core energy is about teaching. I teach experiences. And I have a structured step by step stage by stage, why the Aboriginal elders who also develop this, do it in a much more nonlinear, non verbal? Why, and you watch them work, and it’s just like, but our Western mind feels like it rejects that way. Yes. And so this is one way of doing it. It’s not the only way. Yeah. And you’ll know people that actually understand this intrinsically.

 

 

Yes.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yes. And you’ll see it in movies. You’re setting, you’ll feel it in songs, you’ll feel like when it aligns with the natural laws, it resonates with us. Yes. And so that’s, you know, is about us finding that.

 

Bryn Edwards 

That is so cool. So the last question I asked all my guests, is, it’s pretty huge. This

 

 

is

 

Bryn Edwards 

if, if I was to able to slow everyone down five to 10 minutes, everyone and you can just pop a question is the collective consciousness, all of us to consider individually? What would that mean?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

What popped into my head is, what are the secrets of the universe? And the second one was, what’s the meaning of life? What secrets of the universe?

 

 

Why do you think that popped up?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Because that plays on the inquisitiveness of people wanting to know this.

 

 

Yes. Yes. And consider that answers life big. Well, something bigger than themselves.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

Yeah. And consider that there are secrets of the universe.

 

 

It’s been awesome talking to you today.

 

Roslyn Snyder 

It’s been quite, quite, it’s been really good. Because as I said to you on the phone, I, I’ve developed this and I haven’t really had the opportunity to sort of talk to a lot of people about it. Yeah, and I’ve I’ve talked to Some people, but you often get people just like, this is too much. Yeah. So it was really good. And your questions were on the money.

 

Bryn Edwards 

So if somebody wants to reach out and find you, how do they do that?

 

Roslyn Snyder 

We have a website wisdom in your life.com.au.

 

 

There you go. And

 

Roslyn Snyder 

we have a whole range of different programmes all using this, but in all different levels. So we have healing programmes, for those that have fragmented minds, we have unifying humanity for those that want to connect energetically with the rest of the humanity. And we have the latest without borders programme, which actually teaches the whole all of this and develop your mind to that. And we also have training for like mental health professionals who want to use this. Yeah. with their clients.

 

Bryn Edwards 

Awesome. Thank you so much for your time.

 

 

That’s all right.

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